87: Leading the Flock & Improving Innovation, Catching Up on Goosechase's Journey with Andrew Cross, CEO and Founder

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Hello, my name is Holly Owens
and welcome to Ed Up Ed Tech,

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the podcast that keeps you in
the know about all the latest Ed

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Tech happenings.
We interview guests from around

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the globe to give you deeper
insights into the Ed tech

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industry, the field of
instructional design, and more.

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We're proudly a part of
America's leading podcast

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network, The Ed Up Experience.
It's time to sit back and enjoy

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the latest episode of Ed Up Ed
Tech.

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Don't forget that Ed up
listeners can go and get 10% off

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their goose chase subscription
by going to goosechase.com and

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then during the sign up process
enter in the code add up 10

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Hello everyone and welcome to
another amazing episode of Add

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up Ed Tech.
My name is Holly Owens.

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And my name is Nadia Johnson and
we're your host.

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We're excited because we have a
returning guest on the show

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today.
We have Andrew Cross coming back

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to us on Ed up at Tech.
He is the CEO and founder of

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Goose Chase.
Andrew, welcome back.

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Thank you so much for having me
back.

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That's good, I hope.
I guess I didn't mess anything

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up too badly the first time.
So glad to be invited back.

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Definitely not, and we're going
to have a lot of fun getting all

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caught up with you.
But before we jump into some of

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the questions about all the
things you've been doing at

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Goose Chase since we last
talked, give us a brief intro,

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intro and reminder about your
journey into this space.

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For the audience who hasn't yet,
Listen to your episode 64 and we

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will link to that in the show
notes so they can go back.

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But tell us a little bit about
your journey and who you are.

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Yeah, absolutely.
So as you mentioned, I'm Andrew

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Cross, Founder and CEO of Goose
Chase.

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And then for those who haven't
heard about us or our story, we

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actually started at a hackathon
12 years ago, which is so long

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ago to say, but we were focused
on being a scavenger hunt app at

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the time and you know, early
days.

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With the product out there and
what we found is that customers

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kept pushing the boundaries of
what was possible.

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And for us, we liked that.
We liked seeing them kind of go

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beyond what you're supposed to
maybe do with the traditional

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scavenger hunt and what we
really started to see over the

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years.
Is it no longer really fit what

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a scavenger hunt could be
considered?

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And we actually started calling
these interactive experiences

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then and started realizing that
we have a much bigger

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opportunity than just being a
scavenger hunt app to create

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something really new and
exciting that hasn't really

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existed before, something that
our customers are really asking

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for.
And so we've really set out to

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build kind of the world's first
ever interactive experience

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platform to power all sorts of
different experiences in the

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education context.
A lot of times that means in

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class learning.
So really experiential learning

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opportunities that can be used
for field trips, for PTA events,

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teacher retreats and
conferences, fundraisers.

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And I think one of the coolest,
most unique examples is during

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COVID, people actually used it
to create the yearbook by

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creating an interactive
experience to kind of collect

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all the different imagery.
That's so cool.

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Yeah, right.
When I heard this story, I kind

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of like, wow, I never would have
thought that.

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And that happens so much for us.
Really great idea.

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Yeah.
Super, super cool and creative.

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I would have loved to be a fly
on the wall for that one, yeah.

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Absolutely.
Well, I that what you just don't

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realize I guess Andrew from
begin to see and find her like

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what people take your technology
and what they can do with it

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then they go, they take it to
the next level, yeah.

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And I think that's the real
magic for us with the platform

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is that we just help everybody,
but in particular educators.

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Improve the engagement, learning
outcomes through these

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interactive experiences.
There's so many different ways.

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There's a lot of different ways
to get students up and out of

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their seats engaging with the
material.

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I know creativity and play in
the classroom is a huge deal

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right now and I think being able
to partner with that kind of

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movement is really, really
exciting for us as well.

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And I think about also I've I've
used some and I I think it might

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have been Goose Chase that I use
for professional development as

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a teacher, like it was a tool
for us to get out and like kind

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of work with our team.
So it's like team building as

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well.
I've seen it be used for for

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cool things like that.
So and I really enjoyed that

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part of our our professional
development.

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But can you tell us a little bit
about what's what's happening at

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Goose Chase?
Like what's new, what are some

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new things that's happening,
exciting things that's happening

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over at Goose Chase?
Yeah, absolutely.

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So one thing that I've been
focusing on in particular is

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just growing our team.
So we actually had, I think

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around 3 new team members start
at the beginning of this year

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and then two new engineers
actually started last week for

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us.
And our philosophy in general is

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to have fewer people on the
team, but get the right people

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and that's really time
consuming.

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I think we're getting close to
like 30 people now or something

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like that.
So the team is growing.

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So that's definitely chewed up a
lot of our time, but we'll pay

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dividends, you know, down the
road with a lot of new feet kind

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of features and capabilities
that we've got.

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We've been working on growing
our community.

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I mentioned the last episode
that we've got a creator

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community that we're we're going
called The Nest.

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There's just a place for
creators to come learn, connect

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and inspire each other.
And really at the end of the

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day, we're trying to just
provide as much value to our

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creators as we possibly can and
just make it a spot that

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everyone can come and get
better.

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So lots of work's been going
into that.

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I mentioned as well that we were
working on rebuilding a lot of

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the foundations of our
platforms.

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Obviously going from a scavenger
hunt app to you know this huge

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interactive experience platform,
lots of things that we need to

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do to help us some changes and
simplifications and just allow

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for the platform to kind of grow
and develop.

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So that's been making some great
progress.

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I think ballpark end of year is
when we think we'll be wrapped

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up that and then the features
will come, you know fast and

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furious after that.
And I think we did something

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well.
We've been doing this.

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That's pretty unique.
We did something that we've

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called the concept car which is
technique from the automotive

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industry.
I'm sure you've seen the, you

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know the fancy cars at the car
shows previously and we thought

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about this cuz we've we've said
we're creating this first ever

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interactive experience platform.
How do we align our team

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internally on what that looks
like?

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And it was a big thing for us
because we want people to all be

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working off the same playbook
essentially and.

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We actually were able to do
something, and that was absurdly

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cool, where we took all
basically the features that

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people had been asking for and
started just painting a picture

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of how those might all fit
together.

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We took an example like a day at
the zoo where you know this

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isn't all possible with the
platform now, but you can wander

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around to the different exhibits
where there's maybe QR codes and

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interactive map, you know,
mission shortlisting cohorts of

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different groups can go through
it together and just saw how

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that would all fit together.
Or another one that we had was

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an immersive history lesson in
the classroom where maybe

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there's multiple choice
questions.

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I know everyone's looking for
this gate admissions where

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you're able to complete one and
then that unlocks another one.

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Maybe and we're pushing
boundaries here or some sort of

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like augmented reality aspect to
it.

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Now just to be clear, like we're
not promising we're building

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these at any given time in the
in the short term, but I think

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it shows how big we can think
about the platform.

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And how this all comes together
and it went extremely well.

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So this is probably something
that made the team even more

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excited about our future.
So that's been a pretty big

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internal thing for us that we've
got a pretty clear picture of

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you know where we're trying to
go and the whole team is very

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aligned around that.
And then obviously going out and

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talking to customers as well as
a huge part of what we do just

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on it on a regular basis.
But we've been making a really

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concerted effort to stay
connected to really the

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community out there of creators
that are are using goose chase

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and and loving it every day.
I have absolutely loved watching

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your growth over the past couple
years.

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I know you've been at this for
12 years but the past like two

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to three years just watching the
different changes.

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I use Goose Chase on some of my
Amazon off sites with people and

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they're like what is this tool
and they they out, they loved

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it.
It like Nadia said team bonding.

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And I am so excited about what
you're doing now and taking the

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platform to the next level
because that's really going to

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offer people a lot of different
options and the versatility with

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Goose Chase and I can't wait to
see it.

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It's going to be amazing.
Yeah, especially in the

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classroom.
Like, this makes me like, can I

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go back to the classroom for a
day just so that I can use it

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with students?
Like it'd be be so much fun.

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This is definitely a tool that
we, when I teach my graduate

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level students that I expose
them to because number one, you

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know, we're async, we're
asynchronous and synchronous and

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mostly we're online, so they
need to do some team bonding,

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you know, with that.
But absolutely, like different,

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different teachers.
And most of my students are

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teachers in New York City public
schools.

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So they'll take it back to their
classrooms and they'll just,

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like you said, like the yearbook
thing, like they'll just be

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creative with it.
Yeah, that's awesome.

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And I think I can genuinely say,
and I never thought I'd be able

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to say this, but 12 years in,
this is by far the most excited

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I am about Goose Chase's future,
just because it feels like we've

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really tapped into something.
So, you know, deep and profound

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and if there's a bit of a, you
know, societal change, I think

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that's happening, that people
are looking for interactive

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experiences in general in the
world.

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And I think we're able to
piggyback and ride that wave a

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lot.
And you know, it's why you see

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experiential learning be so
important and creativity and

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play in the classroom.
Be so important.

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We actually had an elementary
teacher in North Carolina who

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had a student who really had
never picked up a book, had no

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desire to and they tried
one-on-one sessions, different

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reading materials and just
nothing worked and.

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What they did is they actually
created an experience for the

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students to really interact with
the reading material in

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different ways.
And some of the missions were

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super simple, like, you know,
what's the last word on page 47?

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But others were more in depth,
like what is the color red

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symbolized in this chapter?
Or what are some examples of

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irony reflected in this book?
Or even take a photo outside

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school demonstrating the themes
of the book.

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And what ended up happening is
the student actually started to

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enjoy reading because it was fun
and there's a purpose.

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It wasn't just following orders.
And that's like such a good

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example for me of how you can
really, I don't want to call it

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weaponizing, but really apply
experiences to do things that

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really weren't possible before,
maybe some of the traditional

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teaching methods.
So I think, you know, that's

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just the educational focus
there.

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But the idea of just interactive
experiences as a whole, I think

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is just ready to kick off as a
whole.

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Absolutely it is.
And I love the adaptiveness of

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it too, because I feel like, you
know, at certain times, like

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you're saying thinking out,
thinking outside the box, but

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also giving the students the
opportunity to choose their own

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experiences and what they do and
put them more in control.

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And this is at all levels, this
is from K to 12 to adult

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learners that this, this needs
to happen and that adaptability

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is essential, especially as you
continue to to learn and you

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know the cliche lifelong
learner.

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I'm so important there.
So I want to know so you have

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you've you talked about the
yearbook thing and you're

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talking about the situation with
the the student and reading.

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Are there any other stories that
you can share with us about

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what's been happening in the
past year?

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Any customer things that you're
willing you can put out there to

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the public?
Yeah.

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So we had a really interesting
school in Nebraska, their

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foreign language department,
that actually had students

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learning Russian.
And I think one of the missions

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they came up with that was so
interesting to me is that they

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actually had challenged the
students to go out and find

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another teacher and teach them a
phrase in Russian and then

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record them practicing.
And I'm sure you you can all

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relate.
Students love, you know,

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flipping things and teaching a
teacher and maybe getting a kick

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out of, you know, sometimes poor
pronunciation that comes out.

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But I think again, it's just
such a clever way of adding that

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joy and.
Activity.

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You mentioned letting students
choose their own path and

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keeping them engaged and having
fun that way.

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I think that's a good example.
We also had an English language

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arts teacher who actually
flipped the script, which I

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thought was really cool, where
she had the students create the

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goose chase to show mastery of a
topic or concept.

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And not allowed those students
to show that they really get it,

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but it also made the other
students in the class more

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excited because they were able
to participate in experience

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crafted by their peers.
So they were more into it.

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They put their best effort
forward.

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So it was kind of this cool
inversion of the usual way of

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things, but actually even more
impactful in some ways there as

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well.
So pretty kind of creative

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outside the box thinking there
as well.

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I am just like, I'm just, I'm
just again, I'm just the

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neighbor with the growth of
goose chasing, all the different

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things that you're doing and how
things have changed since

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inception.
So what about the upcoming year?

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It's been about 8 months since
you were on the last episode of

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Edible Tech.
You're just changing your logo

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and we're seeing some changes
happening.

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Are there anything, anything
that you can share without

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violating any NDA agreements
about the upcoming year, what

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you have on the docket?
Yeah, absolutely.

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So I I alluded before that we're
kind of aiming to to wrap up our

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foundational work what we're
calling internally as kind of

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2.0 around the end of this year.
So that's definitely probably

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top priority internally.
We know afterwards probably gate

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admissions is going to be what
we're going to be working on.

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Hopefully our product team isn't
going to be too mad at me for

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for teasing that no, no
commitments, but that's

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definitely where we're thinking
right now.

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That's definitely our most.
Requested I'd say feature for

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years now.
So we're really excited to

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potentially start working on
that.

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Another thing that's really
important for us, I mentioned

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that we were we're seeing this
really creativity and play in

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learning wave out starting to
pick up and we really want to

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position ourselves to be known
as the tool for that.

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I think our view on life is so
well aligned to that, that

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whatever people want to do to
bring in play, bring in

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experiences to learning, we
think we have this massive

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opportunity to to power
basically all those experiences

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that can possibly be done.
To the point where I don't know.

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If you remember way back in the
iPhone App Store days there was

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the campaign of there's an app
for that we wanna make.

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I don't care that yeah, we wanna
make there's an experience for

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that.
I think.

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I think that really captures our
view extremely well, saying

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whatever you need to do.
There is an experience that

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would make you succeed at what
you're trying to do, and I think

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people haven't really caught on
to that yet, but they're

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starting to.
And our goal now is just to

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really get out there in the
world and help people see how

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powerful interactive experiences
can be for what they're trying

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00:16:23,920 --> 00:16:26,520
to do, both in education and
outside of education as well.

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00:16:27,630 --> 00:16:29,190
I agree.
I think it's one of those

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00:16:29,190 --> 00:16:31,530
things.
Like I think the biggest take

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away that I got from my master's
program and instructional design

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was like experience and
experiential learning is so

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important.
For adults.

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00:16:40,210 --> 00:16:43,970
But I think we're starting to
move toward that like way when

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it comes to K12 education as
well.

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Like we're starting to realize
that kids need to be out of

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their seats.
They need to be experiencing

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00:16:51,370 --> 00:16:53,570
that.
That's going to hold way more

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00:16:53,570 --> 00:16:57,610
value than, you know, kind of
where education was.

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00:16:58,040 --> 00:17:01,240
In the past, before this kind of
wave of technology.

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00:17:01,480 --> 00:17:04,720
So I think I totally agree with
that and I think that I think

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00:17:04,720 --> 00:17:07,760
it's awesome that you're
providing a tool for that kind

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00:17:07,760 --> 00:17:10,599
of experience and experiential
learning.

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00:17:11,079 --> 00:17:14,760
I just want to mention here that
don't forget that add up

339
00:17:14,760 --> 00:17:19,040
listeners can go and get 10% off
their Goose Chase subscription

340
00:17:19,359 --> 00:17:24,040
by going to goosechase.com and
then during the sign up process

341
00:17:24,160 --> 00:17:30,670
enter in the code add up 10
which is Ed UP10 to get 10% off

342
00:17:30,750 --> 00:17:34,190
of your subscription on Andrew
we can't thank you and not for

343
00:17:34,190 --> 00:17:38,110
coming back on and telling us
about all the updates to Goose

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00:17:38,110 --> 00:17:40,150
Chase.
I love Goose Chase.

345
00:17:40,150 --> 00:17:44,070
It's like one of the first
things I heard of when I first

346
00:17:44,070 --> 00:17:47,350
started this podcast and I
started exploring things.

347
00:17:47,350 --> 00:17:50,670
So thank you so much for being
willing to come back and share

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00:17:50,670 --> 00:17:52,730
your updates with us.
No problem.

349
00:17:52,730 --> 00:17:53,850
Thank you so much for having me
back.

350
00:17:53,850 --> 00:17:56,010
That was a lot of fun, as was
the first time.

351
00:17:56,010 --> 00:17:58,090
But it's extra fun this time.
Let's put it that way.

352
00:17:59,690 --> 00:18:02,450
Yes, nice.
So nice meeting with you and

353
00:18:02,450 --> 00:18:04,490
talking to you about Goose
Chase.

354
00:18:05,410 --> 00:18:13,700
Likewise, Nadia.
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TV J23 you've just experienced
and another amazing episode of

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Be sure to visit

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00:19:18,270 --> 00:19:24,350
ourwebsite@edupedtech.com to get
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373
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Tech Happy days.
See you next time.