66: Why Most eLearning is Crap & Solutions for Fixing it, A Conversation with the Impeccable Tim Slade, Founder the eLearning Designer's Academy

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Hello, my name is Holly Owens
and welcome to Ed up edtech the

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podcast that keeps you.
In the know about all the latest

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00:00:10,500 --> 00:00:14,300
edtech happenings.
We interview guests from around

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the globe to give you deeper
insights into the Ed tech

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industry, the field of
instructional design, and more,

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we're proudly a part of
America's leading podcast

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Network the Ed up, experience.
It's time to sit back and enjoy.

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Enjoy the latest episode of Ed
up attack.

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But first, a quick word from
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Hello everyone and happy New

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Year.
Welcome to the first episode of

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Ed up, Ed tech for season 3 and
you're not going to believe the

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guests I have today.
I know you've been seeing posts

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only.
Then I've been saying different

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things about this guest, but
today on the show, we have the

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one and only Tim Slade.
Tim Slade, welcome to the show.

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Yeah.
Thank you so much for having me,

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holly.
I'm so Excited to talk to, you

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have lots of questions that I
prepared, but first, I want to

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give you the opportunity to tell
us your story and your journey

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and all the things about you
coming into this e-learning

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space.
Yeah, so I currently work as a

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freelance e-learning designer
and developer and I'm also the

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creator of the e-learning
designers Academy which I know

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will talk a little bit more
about later, but I've been

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working in this industry for a
little over 15 years now and

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like most folks can In this
industry, I fell into it

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completely, by accident.
I don't have any formal

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background and any of the stuff
that I do I used to catch

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shoplifters for a living and I
have a degree in criminal

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justice.
And the thing I always tell

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people is one day, my boss came
to me and he said, hey, you're

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really good at catching
shoplifters, which I was, and it

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said, you should be training
others.

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How to catch shoplifters.
They're just so happen to be a

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training coordinator job for the
Store I was working at at their

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corporate office in the loss,
prevention department.

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And so I applied for it thinking
that it would Advance my loss,

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prevention career and I managed
to get the job and it was

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through that experience that I
was introduced into e-learning

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and instructional design and
that's kind of how I

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transitioned into this industry,
totally by accident.

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And that's what I've been doing
ever since.

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I love hearing the story, but I
also love reading the story.

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I was like, I had no idea before
I read the book.

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That that was your story and I
was like taking it back.

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I was like interesting path
because you do encounter a lot

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of and current instructional
designers, Lou cops and being

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one of them whose past wasn't
ever going to be instructional

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design.
And now, here we are having this

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conversation.
Yeah, you know, the reason I

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always tell that story, whenever
I have the opportunity is so

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many people who are new or
trying to get into this.

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This industry they don't they
don't realize that everybody

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else was in the same boat that
they're like that imposter

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syndrome and the insecurity and
feeling like you don't belong.

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Everyone else in this industry,
felt that way at some point and

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it's because we all were doing
something else before we

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transitioned into this.
Yeah, absolutely.

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And that's sometimes, I still
feel like that.

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No, I was certain points where
you're the type of person.

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Like we are to, we're always
learning, you're like, oh my

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gosh, I had no idea that it had
like a weakness or I need to UPS

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go in this area so that's yep.
That's one of the things I love

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about this.
Community.

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All right.
You're an e-learning Guru as I

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see it.
So I want to know.

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How do you define e-learning?
That's a good question.

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I were to go back 15 years ago
when I first fell into this

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industry, you learning would
have meant something like a

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PowerPoint slide with the next
button and a quiz at the end of

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it.
And it would have been built in

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a tool like at the time
articulate Studio, which was a

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PowerPoint plug-in.
And then, eventually storyline

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and I think for a lot of people
in this industry, people who are

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Newer tend to think of
e-learning as something you

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build in a tool like storyline
or Captivate or rise for me when

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you really think about, you
learning as electronic learning

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and you take a more holistic
approach.

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It's anything that's delivered
on a digital device, whether

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it's YouTube or even listening
to a podcast like this could be

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considered a form of e-learning.
It's any sort of learning

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experience that's consumed on a
digital device.

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What I always try to promote is
that e-learning is really a

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broad term.
That means a lot of different,

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Types of synchronous
asynchronous interactive and

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passive experiences 100%.
And I love it that you said

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broad because you know, most of
the time, the people the guests

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that they have on the show and I
know the audience to the edtech

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like ask them to Define edtech
and you get a different answer

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every time it's completely broad
but I love asking this question

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because it gives you Insight
it's into the community and

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insights into what's expected
and that type of ecosystem.

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So I love asking that question.
Yeah, I think with a lot of

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these Terms whether it's micro
learning or e-learning or

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edtech.
We're really good at groupthink

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in this industry when it comes
to those terms.

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And absolutely.
Yeah.

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I've yet to have somebody really
clearly defined the difference

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between Ed Tech and e-learning,
they're all educational

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platforms that are digital.
So and I kind of you at all as

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one of the same thing and of
course there's categories within

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that but the big umbrella it's
all the same.

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Yes I agree with you.
I totally think that it's a huge

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umbrella learning and sometimes
it's hard for me and I'm kind of

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going off.
Script a little bit here but

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sure what I think about edtech
and instructional technology,

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those are synonymous to me but
some people see them.

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As two, different things
structural technology can be

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used in the classroom or outside
of the classroom, but Ed Tech in

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but also be used inside the
classroom, but on the

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peripheral, they're kind of
synonymous but people see them

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as two distinctly different
things.

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I was just thinking about that.
When you're talking about

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umbrella that you learning, I
would agree with you.

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I view them as synonymous as
well.

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We get more specific with the
term.

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You know, are we talking about
learning management systems?

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Or learning experience
platforms.

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That's where we start seeing
differentiations.

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But these terms in general, they
can mean many different things

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depending on who you ask.
Yeah, absolutely.

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We can have a whole another
podcast episode about semantics,

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and denotations, and
connotations in the e-learning

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world.
Sure, we'll save that for

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another day.
So, I found it interesting that

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when I read your book and also,
I know that you talked about

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this quite a bit, why the most
of e-learning fails and why it

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sucks.
Why is it crab?

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Like it is Is in 10.
I can tell you just from

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experiencing the corporate
instructional designer role.

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Now, I'm totally on your side
about this.

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I'm like most of it.
Does suck in it fails, and it's

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crap, like, the winners don't
learn.

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So why do you believe this and
how do we fix it?

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Yeah, I do believe that most
corporate e-learning is crap.

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Tell you the history of why?
I say that every time I go get a

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haircut, the person cutting my
hair inevitably, they're wanting

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to start a conversation and so
they'll ask what do you do for a

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living?
And I used to say I mean

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e-learning designer and of
course that didn't translate, or

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I'd say I'm an instructional
designer, none of that would

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translate.
And so, one day, I told the

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person cutting my hair and like,
you know, when you start a new

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job and you have to sit at the
computer and you have to go

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through those courses to tell
you, not to touch your

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co-workers inappropriately and
they immediately know exactly

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what I'm talking.
Yeah, that's the light bulbs go

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off.
Uh-huh.

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And I go.
Yeah.

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I designed those and then I
realized that's not the right

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thing to say because then they
Immediately you're dead to them

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at that point.
So now I tell people I help

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companies design better versions
of those courses but there's

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this visceral reaction with
people who don't work in this

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industry, when you say CBT or
online training or

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computer-based course, and it's
because they've had to sit

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through these really awful
poorly designed learning

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experiences that are more about
checking off a box.

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Then it is about learning
something new, and I think for a

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lot of people and a lot of
organizations, they've

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translated that into Two people
hate e-learning and I don't

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think that people hate
e-learning.

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I mean people love YouTube.
We go to YouTube all the time

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when we love Tick-Tock.
I'm right.

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That's all right person, that's
all that's all e-learning but

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people hate is bad e-learning.
So I think most corporate

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training sucks and I think as
instructional designers and

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learning professionals the
sooner we can all realize that

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we've probably been doing our
Learners and organizations a

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disservice with some of the and
I'm using air quotes here

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training we've been creating the
the Sooner we can get to

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designing things that are
effective and we can design

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e-learning that is engaging and
effective and valuable.

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It just means not simply
converting power point slides

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into a course.
And next button and a job is

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Bored Bored.
Totally, I've experienced that

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I'm like, are we all have how
you know, the teacher and me is

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a screaming on the inside when I
hear that come out of somebody's

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mouth.
Yeah, yeah.

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So I think I think what you're
saying here is we fix it by

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evaluating what we did wrong in
previous iterations or figure

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out ways in which were impactful
to the learner and make it

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meaningful to the learner
because you know, it's through

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change behavior that people will
learn, that's what they learn.

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So you have to make your
e-learning like that and

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speaking of great resources and
things to look at when you're

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doing this, tell us a bit about
all these different and Devers

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you are involved in.
You do so much out on the

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Community.
You have a very learning

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designers Community, you have
your book, you have the academy.

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First of all, how do you do all
this and second of all tell us

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about them.
Yeah, so before I started

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freelancing full time, I used to
manage a large instructional

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design team at a major
technology company.

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And when I first was hired into
that role, the team, we were

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primarily focused at the time on
e-learning design and

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development for the
organization.

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And none of these people had any
experience.

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Designing or developing
e-learning.

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And so I spent the first six
months of my time at this

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company, upskilling everyone on
my process and after I finish

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doing that I realized oh I think
I have a book here.

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It was a combination or the
culmination of everything that I

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had taught myself but till that
point in my career.

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And so the first thing that I
spent like nine months writing,

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the e-learning designers
handbook, that's my primary book

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and it was meant to be a
resource to provide Not just

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Theory.
There's you know there's so much

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Theory out there which is
important.

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But understanding the theory is
only as good as your ability to

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apply it practically in the work
environment and so I wanted.

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Yeah, so I wanted to provide
really practical down-to-earth

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tips advice processes on how to
design and develop e-learning

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and so it started with the book
and then I started freelancing

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full-time in 2019 and I quit
that job.

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I wanted to continue to expand
that offering in different

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That's beyond the book.
And so, I had done some courses

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with LinkedIn learning and
through that experience, I

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really kind of cut my teeth on.
How do you create kind of an

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online course from that
perspective?

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Like a video-based course,
teaching, people stuff.

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And so I used my experiences
from that, that's ultimately

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what became the e-learning
designers Academy which has now

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evolved even further into our
free community and we do online

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courses and cohort programs.
And so it all started with me

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trying to upskill a team of Nani
learning designers, Well,

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designers into e learning and
instructional design, and it's

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kind of just snowballed ever
since.

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What an incredible journey and
so many different things that

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have come out of that.
And I want people to pay

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attention, when you said
initially, you train people

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about your process.
Yeah.

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How you are going to do things
like intake and development in

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the different phases and stages
of e-learning.

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Instructional design developing
like a course, I love that

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because people don't realize
like you can't come into a

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meeting with a smiie and expect
them to understand exactly how

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this Whole thing is going to
work, you really have to lay it

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out for them.
Yeah and that goes back to the

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point about the theory to your
point.

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You can't walk into a meeting
with a stakeholder in a subject

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matter expert and your business
partners.

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And just think that your
understanding of the theory is

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going to get stuff.
Done so much of what we do is

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instructional designers, in my
opinion.

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And my experience is so much
more than just Theory, it's

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project management, stakeholder
management.

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And then using the tools and the
visual design and there's also

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much that goes into when we're
Talking about me learning.

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There's so much that goes into
it Beyond.

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Just the theory.
Yes, the theory is the

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foundation of everything that we
do, but like, actually get it

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done, there's a lot more.
Absolutely.

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You know, when I talk to
teachers that are coming into

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the field and they're like, I
have no idea what a d is.

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I'm like, you do a day every
day.

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When you develop your lessons,
that's a d, you're putting into

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play, for analyzing, your
learner's are doing the needs

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assessment.
You're developing something that

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you want some sort of change
Behavior around.

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You're designing, it, you're
putting Get out there, you

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implement it and then you
evaluate it based off of either,

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what an assessment or you're
getting feedback from the

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students, how they enjoyed it.
That's a d, you're doing it.

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This is up in the different and
the different way.

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Exactly.
So yeah, definitely loves it.

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That comment around the theories
and how you can't just say, oh,

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I'm using adding our Museum Sam
or you know, I'm using Merrill's

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principles.
I don't say that.

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I'm just doing it, right?
Exactly.

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Yeah.
All right, for the people in the

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audience who are new to this
industry, Tree or this ecosystem

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of e-learning and everything
that it encompasses.

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What are the top three pieces of
advice you would offer for the

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newbies that are jumping into
this field?

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With ice, bring sweet 11, start
creating e-learning, content,

295
00:15:07,000 --> 00:15:10,400
faster easier.
And with more pleasure I spring,

296
00:15:10,400 --> 00:15:14,100
sweet has everything you need to
fall in love with your authoring

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00:15:14,300 --> 00:15:17,100
tools for creating beautiful
interactive courses.

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00:15:17,300 --> 00:15:20,300
I Spring Library with ready to
go design assets.

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00:15:20,400 --> 00:15:25,400
Treat yourself to less stress,
less complexity more drive, more

300
00:15:25,400 --> 00:15:28,600
possibilities and more love for
your work.

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00:15:28,700 --> 00:15:38,300
Try, I spring sweet 11 for free.
Oh gosh, um, I know, I know it's

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like pick three, just three, I
guess.

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My number one thing would be in
this applies, whether you're

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doing e-learning or not as focus
on not what people need to know.

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But what people need to do in a
workplace setting, which is

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mostly what corporate lnd is,
people don't need to know

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anything, they need to do things
on the job.

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Yes.
And so focus on doing first and

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that extends, not just To what
you're doing by yourself as an

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instructional designer.
But even when you're interacting

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with your stakeholders and your
smi's, don't talk about knowing

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things talk about doing things,
I would say my number 2 tip

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would be be willing to talk your
stakeholders and subject matter

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experts out of training and it
seems counterintuitive to talk

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people out of.
I love this tip needing to be

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there, but I think to be truly
objective, we have to be willing

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to admit.
The training is not the answer,

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so often trainings, not the
answer and being willing to push

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back and talk them out of
training and ask Mark Britt, he

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works for the learning Guild and
he posted something on Twitter

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the other day.
I can't, I'm going to butcher

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00:16:47,700 --> 00:16:50,900
what he said, but he said one of
his favorite questions to ask

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his stakeholders or smees is
what if training wasn't an

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option, what would you do?
And just that little thought,

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experiment, makes you question.
How else can we solve the

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performance issue?
And maybe you realize that

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trainings.
Needed at all.

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And then I think my third and
final tip would be that kind of

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going back to our previous
little conversation.

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About the theory is that
recognize that specifically

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e-learning development is just
as much instructional design and

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learning theory as it is
multimedia, development,

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graphic, design visual design
knowing how to edit audio and

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video and bring the other
Graphics or edit photos, and

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create your own Graphics or edit
Graphics.

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That's a big part of it.
And I think one of the big

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points I make towards the end of
the book and I've made this

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before, is that e-learning is a
tool for Visual Communications.

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It's a piece of potentially
interactive multimedia, and if a

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course, doesn't look good.
If you're not using the

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opportunity to use your slide,
your screens to show your

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learner's what you're trying to
say.

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And if it's not intuitive and
easy to use and it doesn't

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matter.
How instructionally sounded owes

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all those other things that have
to support its Effectiveness

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from an instructional design
standpoint because of the

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nature.
Sure of what it is.

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A piece of interactive digital
multimedia, if that makes any

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sense.
Yes it does.

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And I'm so happy that you listed
that as number three because

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there's a lot of conversations I
hear from people they think,

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because if they are a guru in
some of these areas that's going

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to give them the job or that's
all they need.

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I try to deter people from
thinking the technology is the

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only thing you need because it's
not.

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It's the supporting Foundation
upon, which you are doing these

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things.
Great advice.

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Absolutely.
Wonderful advice for people who

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are new into the field.
And along with that, you have

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all these great resources, the
wonderful book and you have

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places for people to go.
But as yourself, where do you go

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00:18:46,700 --> 00:18:51,600
to learn where your favorite
resources for me when I need to

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learn something new?
Honestly?

364
00:18:54,000 --> 00:18:56,100
YouTube is probably my go-to
spot.

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Google it and find a YouTube
video that teaches me how to do

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it.
Yep.

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Catherine Lombardo Z.
She's another person in our

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industry, who's been
Instructional design for ever

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00:19:06,100 --> 00:19:08,600
and ever and ever and she's an
author and thought leader and

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all this great stuff.
And one of the things when I

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worked at a previous company, we
hired her as a consultant and

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one of the things that she
helped me understand is that as

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people they get more extensive
in their their level of

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expertise of a particular thing,
their need for formal training.

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Reduces it becomes more about
resources and your network and

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00:19:29,200 --> 00:19:30,600
all of that stuff.
And so, one of the things I've

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learned about myself is that as
being a deeper level of

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00:19:33,108 --> 00:19:36,200
expertise in a given thing, It
becomes less about your need for

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00:19:36,200 --> 00:19:39,400
formal training and more about
Connections and network and

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00:19:39,400 --> 00:19:41,400
resources.
And so for me I learned a lot

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from my network of people or
when I go to a conference it's

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00:19:44,700 --> 00:19:47,800
more about seeing other people
in the industry and connecting

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00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:50,200
and learning from them and
seeing what they're doing and

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00:19:50,500 --> 00:19:52,900
and when I just need to learn
something quick and easy it's

385
00:19:52,900 --> 00:19:56,700
usually YouTube.
I love it so simple yet.

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00:19:56,700 --> 00:20:00,100
So impactful.
Yeah, that YouTube is something

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00:20:00,100 --> 00:20:02,200
else.
I'll tell you and I could have a

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00:20:02,208 --> 00:20:04,700
whole conversation around how
college is going to become.

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I like you too, but we'll save
that for another day, honestly.

390
00:20:08,000 --> 00:20:10,500
It's just it's amazing.
Judges will become obsolete

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because of YouTube me.
Yes, exactly.

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That's what I meant to say.
Yeah, it's just crazy that I

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00:20:16,000 --> 00:20:17,900
can't wait to see.
Like, I tell people all the

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00:20:17,908 --> 00:20:20,500
time, I can't wait to become the
dinosaur in the room because I

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want to see what these next
Generations are going to do.

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I cannot wait.
It's going to be so exciting,

397
00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:29,700
sit back, think more and more
people are going to be going

398
00:20:29,700 --> 00:20:32,800
against the grain.
If you will of what people like

399
00:20:32,800 --> 00:20:34,700
you and me, were gold is what
you're supposed.

400
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To do supposed to go to college
and I'm supposed to get a bunch

401
00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:38,800
of debt and then go get a
corporate job.

402
00:20:38,800 --> 00:20:42,200
And I think a lot of kids,
nowadays are going to go against

403
00:20:42,200 --> 00:20:46,400
that and make their own way and
learn things more practically

404
00:20:46,400 --> 00:20:50,300
rather than going to college and
spending thousands of dollars.

405
00:20:50,300 --> 00:20:52,400
If there was a great story that
I'll say this real quickly,

406
00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:54,200
there's a great story can
remember where I saw it.

407
00:20:54,200 --> 00:20:58,000
But there was this kid, he was
like 19 years old, and he wanted

408
00:20:58,000 --> 00:21:00,800
to learn about coding.
And, you know, a lot of colleges

409
00:21:00,800 --> 00:21:03,500
you can just walk in and go sit
in a classroom and listen to a

410
00:21:03,500 --> 00:21:06,600
professor, right?
And never paint and he went and

411
00:21:06,600 --> 00:21:10,900
learned how to code by going to
these college classes and

412
00:21:10,900 --> 00:21:13,000
sitting in the back pretending
to be a student.

413
00:21:13,100 --> 00:21:15,500
Of course he never earned a
degree or any credit hours, but

414
00:21:15,500 --> 00:21:18,400
he learned what he needed to be
able to go get a job, you know,

415
00:21:18,400 --> 00:21:22,300
for free first time, that's
crazy to us being so ingrained

416
00:21:22,300 --> 00:21:25,300
in the how we were raised.
But to me, I love that.

417
00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:28,100
Why not the ethics of that are
questionable?

418
00:21:28,200 --> 00:21:32,000
Yeah, I remember, I remember I
went and saw you know, when my

419
00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:34,700
friends had college classes, I
just go sit with them.

420
00:21:34,800 --> 00:21:37,900
And then the classroom and learn
about whatever and the professor

421
00:21:37,900 --> 00:21:39,300
didn't care, you know, I don't
know.

422
00:21:39,800 --> 00:21:41,800
So yeah, I mean, those big
lecture Halls, how do you know

423
00:21:41,800 --> 00:21:43,000
that?
There's somebody who's not

424
00:21:43,000 --> 00:21:45,300
supposed to be there.
How do you know, you're not like

425
00:21:45,300 --> 00:21:48,100
attendance, like, 300 people
sometimes in those rooms.

426
00:21:48,400 --> 00:21:50,100
Absolutely, but I love that
store.

427
00:21:50,200 --> 00:21:52,800
I know, there's a story like Ed
surgery or somebody came out

428
00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:55,200
with recently about the students
that don't want to go to

429
00:21:55,200 --> 00:21:56,600
college.
And they're talking about the

430
00:21:56,600 --> 00:21:58,900
Avenues are taking like, whether
that's your trade schools, are

431
00:21:58,900 --> 00:22:01,500
there going directly into the
workforce After High School?

432
00:22:01,500 --> 00:22:03,700
Because they've gone to a
special Academy or something,

433
00:22:03,700 --> 00:22:06,200
where they learned the skills.
The trade and they just can go

434
00:22:06,200 --> 00:22:08,500
right into it.
I love those alternative

435
00:22:08,500 --> 00:22:11,500
options, you know, as a teacher
I had so many students who I

436
00:22:11,508 --> 00:22:13,700
tried to tell them about college
and then I realized like that

437
00:22:13,700 --> 00:22:15,600
was a losing battle.
They don't want to go to

438
00:22:15,600 --> 00:22:18,100
college, they want to do other
things and they have other

439
00:22:18,100 --> 00:22:20,700
creative mindsets to do those
other things.

440
00:22:21,100 --> 00:22:23,400
Normally, the point them, the
resources for that.

441
00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:26,000
Yeah.
And I mean, I feel like at least

442
00:22:26,000 --> 00:22:29,900
my generation growing up in the
90s and then graduating in the

443
00:22:29,900 --> 00:22:33,500
early 2000s from high school,
you know, there was so much

444
00:22:33,500 --> 00:22:36,300
pressure about college.
And getting a degree and all of

445
00:22:36,300 --> 00:22:38,300
that is not to get weird about
it.

446
00:22:38,300 --> 00:22:40,500
But it's just a social
construct, you know what I mean?

447
00:22:40,500 --> 00:22:42,800
And I think a lot of people are
realizing.

448
00:22:43,100 --> 00:22:46,300
I know this, I mean my degree in
criminal justice, I transitioned

449
00:22:46,300 --> 00:22:49,200
into training and development,
the year, I graduated with my

450
00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:52,000
criminal justice degree.
I've never used that thing and

451
00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:55,100
it cost me an arm and a leg.
And if I can go back in time, I

452
00:22:55,100 --> 00:22:57,100
would totally have not done
that.

453
00:22:57,500 --> 00:22:59,500
I know.
And I completely agree with you.

454
00:22:59,500 --> 00:23:02,800
So ingrained in me as well and
I'm from the same generation and

455
00:23:02,800 --> 00:23:06,900
I'm like, what was I thinking?
Like, what was I doing?

456
00:23:06,900 --> 00:23:08,500
Because what you were told to
thing, you know?

457
00:23:08,500 --> 00:23:11,100
Yes.
But your that's exactly age, you

458
00:23:11,100 --> 00:23:11,800
know.
Yes.

459
00:23:12,100 --> 00:23:14,100
Thank you Boomers and gen xers,
parents.

460
00:23:14,100 --> 00:23:16,800
Yeah.
Thank you so much that all to

461
00:23:16,800 --> 00:23:19,700
you for all the drama.
Yeah.

462
00:23:20,700 --> 00:23:22,400
That could be a separate podcast
as yes.

463
00:23:22,400 --> 00:23:24,200
Absolutely.
We have to find somebody who's

464
00:23:24,200 --> 00:23:28,000
involved in the psychology of
like Millennials and all of, you

465
00:23:28,008 --> 00:23:30,000
know, there's any holes,
whatever Generation.

466
00:23:30,400 --> 00:23:32,600
All right, so you've done a lot
of great things.

467
00:23:32,600 --> 00:23:34,200
You've been in the industry for
quite a bit.

468
00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:36,100
Is there anything?
Thing coming up for you or there

469
00:23:36,100 --> 00:23:39,600
any new Endeavors on the horizon
and books or otherwise that you

470
00:23:39,600 --> 00:23:41,400
have coming up that you're
willing to share and tell us

471
00:23:41,400 --> 00:23:45,500
about yeah sure.
So I had a friend of me asking

472
00:23:45,500 --> 00:23:47,400
for a friend of mine asked if I
was going to write a third

473
00:23:47,400 --> 00:23:50,300
edition of my book and they
didn't occur to me and then I

474
00:23:50,300 --> 00:23:52,200
started thinking I'm like oh
yeah I think I could write a

475
00:23:52,208 --> 00:23:55,500
third edition so I might do that
but I don't know if that'll be

476
00:23:55,500 --> 00:23:58,900
next year.
I'm working on a bunch of new

477
00:23:58,900 --> 00:24:01,500
course content for the
e-learning designers Academy

478
00:24:01,500 --> 00:24:04,700
which will go live next year.
So yeah.

479
00:24:04,800 --> 00:24:07,800
Keeping busy with that stuff and
by next year, you mean this

480
00:24:07,800 --> 00:24:10,600
year.
Yeah, fine 23.

481
00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:15,000
Yeah, I know, I know, yeah, he's
gonna take a good month or two

482
00:24:15,000 --> 00:24:17,200
before we start.
I know I'm gonna see ya.

483
00:24:17,200 --> 00:24:21,100
I'm gonna write 2022 on all my
stuff in my little notes for

484
00:24:21,100 --> 00:24:24,000
quite a while.
Well, that's good to hear.

485
00:24:24,000 --> 00:24:27,200
I'm definitely gonna be first in
line for the new book and the

486
00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:31,100
you learning academy.
I know gets rave reviews, I can

487
00:24:31,100 --> 00:24:33,400
only imagine the content that
you're developing, and how

488
00:24:33,400 --> 00:24:35,900
Stellar it is.
It should happen.

489
00:24:36,500 --> 00:24:38,800
Yes, its yes.
It shouldn't be good.

490
00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:42,800
So my final two questions that I
ask on the show.

491
00:24:42,900 --> 00:24:46,300
It's really it's like it's two
in one and then a third.

492
00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:48,600
So is there anything that we
missed?

493
00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:52,300
Our is there anything else you'd
like to share with the audience

494
00:24:52,500 --> 00:24:56,400
and get out your crystal ball?
And tell us what the future?

495
00:24:56,400 --> 00:24:59,600
Be learning looks like.
So what do you miss and what is

496
00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:02,900
the future of e-learning?
Gosh, I don't know if we missed

497
00:25:02,900 --> 00:25:04,600
anything, we went something
else.

498
00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:08,000
A lot of different directions.
You know what, here's what I say

499
00:25:08,200 --> 00:25:11,200
when I get asked the question
about like what do you think the

500
00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:14,800
future of lndia's?
And I regard that question the

501
00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:16,900
same as when you're in an
interview and they go where do

502
00:25:16,900 --> 00:25:19,600
you see yourself in five years?
And my answer is always like

503
00:25:20,200 --> 00:25:22,600
hell if I know I really don't
know I don't have a crystal

504
00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:24,400
ball.
I could have never predicted

505
00:25:24,400 --> 00:25:27,100
myself in this industry so I try
not to predict it because you

506
00:25:27,108 --> 00:25:30,500
never know what new technology
is going to pop up or buzzword

507
00:25:30,500 --> 00:25:33,100
that's going to totally
revolutionize or change the

508
00:25:33,100 --> 00:25:35,600
industry.
And so I am one of those people

509
00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:39,900
who just rides the wave wherever
it takes us and adapt as I need

510
00:25:39,900 --> 00:25:41,200
to.
But I guess I don't know if I

511
00:25:41,208 --> 00:25:45,700
were to say one thing, I guess
what I'd say is everyone's

512
00:25:45,700 --> 00:25:49,400
talking about AR and VR but I
think yes, we're always out from

513
00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:52,300
that being he to, I feel the
same way.

514
00:25:52,500 --> 00:25:54,900
I feel like it's been a buzz for
a while, right?

515
00:25:55,100 --> 00:25:58,900
Yeah, it's just the technology
is not cheap enough impractical.

516
00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:00,900
I don't know if our industry has
figured out.

517
00:26:00,900 --> 00:26:02,400
Exactly.
The Right.

518
00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:05,800
Use case for AR and Are you know
what?

519
00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:07,800
I'm going to say?
Hell, if I know, I don't know.

520
00:26:07,800 --> 00:26:08,700
Yeah.
All right.

521
00:26:08,700 --> 00:26:10,800
That's a great answer.
I absolutely love it.

522
00:26:11,200 --> 00:26:14,500
I have no idea where this thing
is going and I'm going to get my

523
00:26:14,500 --> 00:26:16,700
surfboard and ride this wave and
see what happens.

524
00:26:16,700 --> 00:26:19,800
I love it exact 100%, it's
easier.

525
00:26:20,900 --> 00:26:22,900
I mean, I'm looking forward to
seeing what happens.

526
00:26:22,900 --> 00:26:27,000
I'm like you, I can make
predictions but I really have no

527
00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:28,300
idea.
What's next.

528
00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:31,800
I mean, it's almost like five
years in this world, you know?

529
00:26:31,800 --> 00:26:33,300
I mean, like nothing was
predictable.

530
00:26:33,300 --> 00:26:37,000
So Actly and I totally feel that
way proposed pandemic.

531
00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:39,500
I'm like, oh my gosh, I can't
believe what's happening and how

532
00:26:39,500 --> 00:26:41,700
instructional designers and
e-learning developers.

533
00:26:41,700 --> 00:26:43,100
All these people have come to
the Forefront.

534
00:26:43,100 --> 00:26:45,900
Like people actually know who we
are, we're not just sitting

535
00:26:45,900 --> 00:26:48,400
behind a desk or not some hermit
in some office area.

536
00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:50,900
We are people who know things
and we can do things.

537
00:26:50,900 --> 00:26:53,900
It's fantastic, I love it.
Yeah, for sure.

538
00:26:54,200 --> 00:26:58,500
Well Tim I can't thank you
enough for your time and coming

539
00:26:58,500 --> 00:27:00,300
on the show and sharing all the
things.

540
00:27:00,300 --> 00:27:02,000
And having this conversation
with me, it's been really

541
00:27:02,008 --> 00:27:03,700
enlightening and really fun as
well.

542
00:27:03,900 --> 00:27:04,700
Yeah.
Thank you.

543
00:27:04,708 --> 00:27:07,500
You so much for having me.
Of course and happy New Year.

544
00:27:07,900 --> 00:27:15,400
Yes you've just experienced an
another amazing episode of Ed

545
00:27:15,400 --> 00:27:16,500
up.
Ed Tech.

546
00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:22,500
Be sure to visit our website at
Ed up edtech.com to get all the

547
00:27:22,500 --> 00:27:25,300
updates on the latest edtech
kapiti.

548
00:27:26,000 --> 00:27:27,400
See you next time.