171: Stop Waiting for Permission—Start Leading with Joy: James Gilchrist on Finding Work That Fits You

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Welcome back to another
inspiring episode of Add Up LND.

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Today I have the absolute
pleasure of welcoming a guest

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who is not only a powerhouse in
the LND world, but someone I've

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admired and collaborated with in
many ways behind the scenes.

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James Gilchrist.
James is an LND influencer, Ice

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Spring advocate, consultant, and
dynamic voice in our community.

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He brings decades of experience
and even more insight into what

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what it really takes to grow,
evolve, and lead with purpose in

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this field.
From his early days in the

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theater to launching his own
consulting agency, Lighthouse

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L&D, James shares how leaning
into curiosity, connection, and

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courage shaped his unique path.
In this episode, you'll hear

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wisdom on everything from
breaking into L&D and embracing

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AI to dismantling imposter
syndrome and rethinking how we

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define confidence and success.
If you're a navigator.

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If you're navigating your own
career pivot, feeling stuck in a

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sea of shoulds, this
conversation is exactly what you

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need.
So grab your notebook because

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James is about to drop some
truth bombs and I know you're

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going to walk away with new
clarity and inspiration for your

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own journey.
Let's dig in.

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Hi, we're ispring, an
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our resources, and connect.
Hello everyone and welcome to

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another fantastic episode of Add
Up.

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L and DI am feeling very excited
today to have this guest on this

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show.
James Gilchrist is here and he

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is going to talk about all
things L&D.

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He's an influencer, works with
Ice Spring, he has his own

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consulting business.
He's just he's an all around

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just knows a lot of different
things and I'm expecting and as

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you should, a lot of great
advice here.

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So, James, welcome to the show.
Thank you, Holly, and no

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pressure.
No pressure, you'll be fine.

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You'll be fine.
So why don't we start start out

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with you telling us your story
about how you started and where

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you're at now.
Like your path to how you came

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here.
You have your own business, you

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do a lot of different things.
So tell us about your your, your

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journey.
Well, I'm, it's lovely to meet

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your listeners and I just want
to say you and I have been

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talking about doing this show
for a while and there were a few

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times when and when it didn't
happen.

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No, no, it's a, it's life.
And but life is allowing us to

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be here together today.
And I just want to say how

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excited I am to be in the room
with you because I'm a, I'm a

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huge fan and I love working with
you.

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And we have worked together sort
of in tandem in a lot of ways,

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but we haven't had the chance to
do this.

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We've never done a panel.
We've never had the face to face

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online.
So I'm honored that you've got

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me on your show.
So thanks for that.

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Ditto.
I'm honored that you, you're,

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you got to be here and that we
got to meet in person in Las

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Vegas last.
Year, yes, yes, Dev learned last

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year.
I think that was the first time

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we ever got to be in the in the
same breathing the same.

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Air, yeah, for sure, for sure.
Yeah, well.

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Well, tell us your story, James.
I'm excited to listen to it.

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OK, Well, thanks.
So first, I just want to say I

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was hosting a networking event a
few weeks ago and I was inspired

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to tell the folks in the room
that when they went into their

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breakout sessions and they began
talking to each other for the

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purposes of getting to know each
other and hopefully forging some

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connections and finding waves
forward ways of working,

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collaborating, etcetera.
That they should be mindful of

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their past and their story.
Like you've just asked me to

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share my story, but more focused
on their future.

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Where are they going?
How do they feel about where

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they are now in relationship to
where they see themselves and

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take people on that journey
where what the future looks

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like?
What is it, you know, what do

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you have in store for yourself?
Because it's that story and that

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journey that invites others to
come on it with you.

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You can't do anything about
anything that's happened before.

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And none of us really want to
repeat what we've done before.

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We're all looking for the next
big thing and discovering what

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makes us happy and figuring out,
you know, how we can get more

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passionate about the thing that
happens today and tomorrow and

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the day after that.
So, so I will, but I but I

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understand that context and
knowing is in some cases, just

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how you got into the field of
L&D can be really interesting to

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people who may be on at that
point in their career

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themselves.
So I will tell a little bit of

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that story.
I think it's good for folks to

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know that I spent my entire 20s.
I got an undergraduate degree in

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music and print journalism, and
I immediately started working

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for a theater company.
I was touring colleges and

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universities doing theater and
tended to inform and help

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students get acclimated to the
new, bigger world of being on

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their own and living out, you
know, often very far from home

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and writing music and finding
musicians and starting bands and

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doing all of that.
So no, I didn't, I didn't

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graduate from my university and
immediately try to find a job

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working at some company that
needed learning solutions.

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That was not that was not the
trajectory.

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Yeah.
No, not at all.

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And apart from, you know, this
strong feeling that I needed to

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hang on to something that to
someone else would look viable

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on a resume like an English
degree or my journalism degree.

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I have always been someone who
was looking, looking to the

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stars, as it were, and not and
trying not to get myself too

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worried about, well, to use my
mom's words, how to make a

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living.
You know, That being said, that

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trajectory took me to Fast
forward 10 years and I'm living

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in New York City and I am
auditioning for things.

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I've been cast in a number of
Shakespeare productions because

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I tacked on a A2 year
certification at a place called

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the National Shakespeare
Conservatory in my late 20s.

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And I was lucky enough to get
some great work and some great

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parts and that sort of thing.
But it's New York City, and if

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you don't want to live with 10
people in a shoe box, you need a

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little bit of money coming in.
So it was network time.

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I called a friend.
I phoned a friend can iPhone, a

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friend.
I phoned a friend who said he

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had just seen an opportunity to
work.

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Basically what how he described
it was answering phones at a

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payroll company and I was like,
well, that sounds

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straightforward, not very
exciting, but you know, I

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figured it would be flexible and
it would pay the bills.

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So what happened next?
Well, they hire me, which in my

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mind was kind of amazing because
what they were hoping was that

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they would be bringing people
who had some business acumen and

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understood payroll taxes and,
you know, maybe a little bit of

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accounting and, and all.
And I had none of that.

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But I, but, but I got hired and
I went through their, what I

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thought of as their two week
boot camp.

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So I'm being trained by someone
on the job whose job is not to

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train new hires, but is to be a
manager in their own area.

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And they have their own team and
they are there doing the best

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that they can to give people
what they think they need to

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know to succeed in the job.
That's a nice way of putting it,

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but it was disjointed, it was
distracting.

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There were questions that got
left unanswered.

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Training materials were
definitely more missed than hit.

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But when you know, but I've
always been a good student, so I

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applied myself and I felt OK.
If what they've told me is what

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I need to know, I am reasonably
prepared to do this.

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I couldn't have been more wrong.
I got through it is all I can

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say.
I got through my last, you know,

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the first four months of my time
at this company were during the

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busiest time of year for them,
which was the end of the year

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because lots more things happen
in payroll and business and

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stuff like that.
So there I am struggling.

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I'm going into my own manager's
office like 6 times a day.

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You know, I, I was the guy who
would assure the customer that I

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would get back to them and let
them know the answer to their

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question because I couldn't give
it to him in the moment.

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And then I would just run off
with my notebook and be like,

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OK, what did this mean and what
happened and how badly did I

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mess this up and etcetera.
All of which brought me all of

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that finds me at a time a few
weeks into the job where I'm

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sitting in the break room and I
see they've actually posted

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something on the cork board
saying they're looking for a

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training manager and I thought
they're looking for a training

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manager.
I'm glad they're looking for a

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training manager.
It would have been great if they

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already had a training manager.
But but here's an opportunity

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and I am fresh from out of the
fire.

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So I made an appointment, walked
into the one person HR

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department, sat down, introduced
myself and explained that I was

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really interested in this
posting and I was hoping that

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they would consider me for it
and that I had these ideas and

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that, this and that and the
other I, you know, all of this.

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And the woman sitting across
from me, her name is Patricia.

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Amazing person.
We got to be great friends in

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the future.
She's sitting there in her

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inimitable way, hands folded,
smiling.

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She's just she's just letting me
run down, you know, everything I

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have to say.
And at the end she says, James,

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well, I really appreciate you
coming in to talk to me about

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this.
We'd kind of like to see how you

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do at the job we just hired you
for before we promote you into

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this, into this position.
But, and I give her credit for

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this, she said if the efficient,
if the position is still open

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after the end of the year, come
back and see me.

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And I remembered that and I
thanked her and I went back and

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I lived out my life as a, you
know, struggling payroll

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accountant and came back to her
office and at that point

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explained how much I learned and
that I was still very interested

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in it.
And she gave me the job.

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So wow, that was.
I knew that was gonna happen.

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That was the beginning.
That was the beginning of my

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next 23 years doing things
related to training people and

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creating learning solutions and
figuring out what this whole L&D

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thing is, which at the time, of
course, that was not on my radar

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at all.
You know, I all I knew was I had

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people in front of me who needed
help and there was materials

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that I knew had been used before
that I was expected to use going

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forward that I had used.
And they didn't work for me.

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So I didn't want to, I didn't, I
didn't want to just repeat, you

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know, wash, rinse, repeat
process.

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Yeah, yeah.
Exactly.

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So that's so that's the very
beginning.

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And I think the important thing
to take away from that story is

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recognizing that it's it was my
experience, that it wasn't my

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experience that allowed me to
move the ball down the field to

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be given an opportunity.
All it took was me being

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passionate enough about the
problem and having and being

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solution oriented that someone
recognized that having me

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working for them on that project
or in that capacity would make

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their life easier rather than
harder.

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Yeah, yeah, I love that.
And that's what LM DS all about.

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That's what it's all about.
I love it that you you're a

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theater person.
I could see.

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I can tell just from your voice
and stuff that that would be an

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expectation or an assumption of
mine because your voice is just

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and you the way you present
yourself, you have so much

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confidence when you're
presenting or when you're you

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know, you're the the person
who's moderating stuff in the

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sessions.
I just love that about you.

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I think you're one of the best
people that I've ever seen, like

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moderate some of those sessions
and just be on a stage.

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It's really interesting because
a lot of us and people in the

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audience too, that are in the
L&D space, we kind of fell into

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these roles.
I took the more of the, I would

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say, quote UN quote, the
traditional path.

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I was a high school teacher and
then I transitioned into

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e-learning and then went into
higher education instructional

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design.
But I love the fact that your

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story is not the traditional
path.

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Like you got a job because
you're trying to make a trying

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to make a living, you're trying
to pay the bills and then you

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kind of just put yourself out
there.

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You're very proactive about, you
know, going into the office and

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explaining why you'd be great
fitter, the solutions that you

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could just from knowing what you
were doing.

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I think that's that's so that's
so cool and it and to me, like

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that says a lot to our audience
too.

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Like don't just wait for
somebody to come give you the

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position.
I think a lot of us are like,

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we're stuck maybe in the old
arcade days, like, oh, after 10

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years, I'm really going to get
that promotion from Bob and he's

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going to see all the hard work I
did and then it never comes.

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Yeah, yeah.
Well, that I love that you

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mention that because, because it
is one of the things that I

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learned by doing by putting
myself into the business world.

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And it just, you know, sink or
swim resulted in me picking up

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00:15:11,560 --> 00:15:14,800
some ideas about how it all
worked and what I needed to do

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to succeed and what didn't work
by virtue of experiencing it.

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And I want to go back.
First of all, thank you very

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00:15:23,680 --> 00:15:28,040
much for what you said about me
as a presenter and and etcetera

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00:15:28,040 --> 00:15:30,760
facilitator.
I just want to say for the folks

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listening, 'cause this is about
them.

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Like this is a conversation we
get to have, but in my mind,

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it's all about whoever decides
to tune in and listen to this

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episode, what, you know, how are
we making their day better?

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That kind of thing.
I just want to say that the

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confidence that is perceived is,
is part construct and part

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00:15:55,840 --> 00:15:58,640
choosing where to put my
attention.

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So if, for example, I were to
tell you, putting my attention

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on my audience didn't
necessarily help me reach my

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audience, that might not be the
first thing you would expect.

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I mean, kind of think, well,
where you put your attention is

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where the energy goes.
And, and that's what we're,

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that's what we need to do,
right?

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We've heard focus is important
and putting yourself in the

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shoes of your, of your learner
or your listener or your, in

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your case, your audience, right.
But one of the things that I

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learned as a performer, A
musician, playing on stage with

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a band, doing my own music,
acting in plays, auditioning.

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Yeah, that stuff scares me.
Which is, which is it's a that's

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a whole nother.
Like there's a wonderful,

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00:16:47,120 --> 00:16:51,560
there's a wonderful story to tie
the art of auditioning with

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succeeding in business, which
maybe we can get into.

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But for now, I just want to say
I learned early on that in those

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00:16:58,480 --> 00:17:03,600
moments when I was on stage,
that if I detected my focus or

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my attention moving away from
what was happening in the

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00:17:07,720 --> 00:17:12,640
moment, away from my other
actors, away from what my

283
00:17:12,640 --> 00:17:16,680
thoughts needed to be related to
what I was doing.

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I'm, I'm channeling Yoda here.
I'm like, never his mind on

285
00:17:20,599 --> 00:17:23,119
where he was, what he was doing,
right?

286
00:17:24,200 --> 00:17:28,240
Anytime my attention drifted,
anytime I started to imagine

287
00:17:28,240 --> 00:17:32,560
seeing myself as others were
seeing me, the wheels came off

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00:17:33,000 --> 00:17:37,320
crash and burn.
So one of the reasons why I get

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00:17:37,320 --> 00:17:41,040
so excited about presenting and
facilitating these days is

290
00:17:41,040 --> 00:17:44,800
because I spend time.
And I know I'm going to spend

291
00:17:44,800 --> 00:17:49,040
time beforehand asking myself
the question, why am I doing

292
00:17:49,040 --> 00:17:51,400
this?
What is it that I care about?

293
00:17:51,800 --> 00:17:54,560
What is the best possible
outcome?

294
00:17:55,240 --> 00:18:00,400
And is this fun and answering
those questions for myself so

295
00:18:00,400 --> 00:18:04,280
that I can facilitate a
networking event and be

296
00:18:04,280 --> 00:18:08,800
passionate and outgoing and
hopefully engaging because I

297
00:18:08,800 --> 00:18:13,920
truly care that everyone who's
there is gonna have a great

298
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experience.
That's what I care about.

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So I just lean into that.
Like, what do I care about?

300
00:18:18,680 --> 00:18:21,040
Why am I here?
And pretty soon I'm not thinking

301
00:18:21,040 --> 00:18:24,000
about myself.
I'm not thinking about how I'm

302
00:18:24,000 --> 00:18:25,800
doing.
I'm not thinking about what I

303
00:18:25,800 --> 00:18:29,720
said 2 seconds ago.
I'm just in the moment and I'm

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00:18:29,760 --> 00:18:32,880
present.
And everyone, no matter what

305
00:18:32,880 --> 00:18:37,000
circumstance you're going into
that may feel uncomfortable, if

306
00:18:37,000 --> 00:18:40,240
you ask yourself those questions
and you teach yourself to get in

307
00:18:40,240 --> 00:18:44,520
touch with that part of you,
that is the why you know why

308
00:18:44,520 --> 00:18:46,160
you're doing it, why you're
doing what you do.

309
00:18:47,120 --> 00:18:50,640
You will feel more confident,
you will seem more confident,

310
00:18:50,800 --> 00:18:55,600
and you will actually be better
at what you're there to do.

311
00:18:55,960 --> 00:18:59,400
So that's that's my my hope that
people sort of shake away.

312
00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:03,320
I love that and that's what I
think about with the podcast.

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00:19:03,320 --> 00:19:05,120
That's what I think about every
time I present.

314
00:19:05,120 --> 00:19:09,400
Like I want to be so on and
prepped for the, what I'm

315
00:19:09,400 --> 00:19:13,920
sharing with the audience that I
want them to feel like, you

316
00:19:13,920 --> 00:19:17,160
know, when people say to me at
the end of like a presentation

317
00:19:17,160 --> 00:19:19,720
or the end of like a, a
conference, you know,

318
00:19:19,720 --> 00:19:22,640
interaction or something that
they feel more confident and

319
00:19:22,640 --> 00:19:28,200
they feel ready to start again
or they feel more motivated.

320
00:19:28,200 --> 00:19:30,680
That's exactly what I want to
happen.

321
00:19:31,120 --> 00:19:33,880
That's exactly what I want.
I want to give back.

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00:19:34,240 --> 00:19:38,240
I'm just, you're at the stage in
your career where you're like, I

323
00:19:38,240 --> 00:19:41,560
just want to share what like
you, what I've learned and don't

324
00:19:41,560 --> 00:19:43,840
make the same mistakes as me.
It's kind of like raising

325
00:19:43,840 --> 00:19:46,600
children, like the we don't want
our kids to make the same

326
00:19:46,600 --> 00:19:50,000
mistakes that we made as we were
growing up or, you know,

327
00:19:50,040 --> 00:19:52,880
learning different things.
And I think what you're kind of

328
00:19:52,880 --> 00:19:55,760
alluding to here is an imposter
syndrome that kind of flutters

329
00:19:55,760 --> 00:19:57,920
about throughout L&D.
And.

330
00:19:58,600 --> 00:20:00,920
I think people really struggle
with that.

331
00:20:01,600 --> 00:20:04,800
Yeah, absolutely.
Imposter syndrome is running

332
00:20:04,840 --> 00:20:09,280
rampant, and it's obviously not
limited to our industry.

333
00:20:09,280 --> 00:20:12,040
It happens everywhere.
But there's an aspect of what we

334
00:20:12,040 --> 00:20:16,640
do that involves putting
yourself in view.

335
00:20:17,160 --> 00:20:19,920
You know you can.
You can have a job where no one

336
00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:21,920
ever sees you do what you do.
IT.

337
00:20:22,920 --> 00:20:24,960
Yeah, exactly.
That's exactly what I was

338
00:20:24,960 --> 00:20:26,560
actually.
Thinking about them permits.

339
00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:29,160
I was like in the, I was in the
server room, you know, in my

340
00:20:29,160 --> 00:20:31,440
mind, they were like looking at
the keyboard sticking out of the

341
00:20:31,440 --> 00:20:34,600
wall anyway.
But yeah, the point is, it is

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00:20:34,600 --> 00:20:38,240
true that there is an aspect of
the all the things that get

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00:20:38,240 --> 00:20:41,680
folded up into our larger world,
whether it's talent development,

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00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:45,280
human resources, learning and
development, you know, creating

345
00:20:45,280 --> 00:20:47,840
the solutions, delivering the
solutions, presenting the

346
00:20:47,840 --> 00:20:49,760
solutions, pitching the
solutions.

347
00:20:49,760 --> 00:20:52,880
I mean, there's a lot of people
there's, it's all, it's all

348
00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:55,960
people all the time.
You know, when and many people I

349
00:20:55,960 --> 00:20:58,640
speak to who are getting into
instructional design talk about

350
00:20:58,640 --> 00:21:02,280
how excited they are to learn
the tools and create the stuff

351
00:21:02,560 --> 00:21:06,080
and tap into their inner
creative, artisanal, what have

352
00:21:06,080 --> 00:21:08,800
you to produce, right.
And that is fun.

353
00:21:08,800 --> 00:21:12,920
And I spent 20 years loving that
I could do that.

354
00:21:14,360 --> 00:21:20,800
But as I came to lean into this
chapter of my career slash life

355
00:21:21,240 --> 00:21:27,400
experience, I thought about what
mattered to me and where I felt

356
00:21:27,440 --> 00:21:33,480
the most at home.
And despite being that guy for

357
00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:37,240
all those years that, Oh well,
we need this built like James.

358
00:21:37,360 --> 00:21:39,800
James is up on that.
He's up on the latest tech he

359
00:21:39,800 --> 00:21:41,760
knew.
He's the guy who's teaching

360
00:21:41,760 --> 00:21:43,600
other people how to use this
tool we just bought.

361
00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:46,360
You know, I was that guy.
Right, like you're the expert.

362
00:21:46,680 --> 00:21:50,160
Exactly.
But where I really shine and

363
00:21:50,160 --> 00:21:54,080
where I personally get the most
satisfaction and gratification

364
00:21:54,680 --> 00:21:58,760
is in the conversations with
people that are about to decide

365
00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:01,680
what to do next.
Those moments where decisions

366
00:22:01,680 --> 00:22:04,600
get made.
Those moments where a direction

367
00:22:04,760 --> 00:22:09,000
that you've been going in for a
long time suddenly forks and you

368
00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:11,600
choose to go off in a new
direction.

369
00:22:12,480 --> 00:22:14,840
And one of the wonderful things
about how learning and

370
00:22:14,840 --> 00:22:17,480
development I see is
transitioning as a result of the

371
00:22:17,480 --> 00:22:21,240
latest influx of technology is
that we're being given tools

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00:22:21,240 --> 00:22:25,120
that allow us to be more
flexible in the moment we can

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00:22:25,120 --> 00:22:28,800
create the resource.
And I just talked, I'm gonna

374
00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:33,400
drop a name, Jen Kamerdiner.
She's one of the lovely people

375
00:22:33,400 --> 00:22:37,160
that I have worked with directly
as a client of Lighthouse L&D

376
00:22:37,160 --> 00:22:39,000
Consulting in the past few
years.

377
00:22:39,240 --> 00:22:42,760
She has a company called Clear
Path Learning Solutions.

378
00:22:42,760 --> 00:22:46,640
They're, they're a great,
they're a great firm on a great

379
00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:52,360
L&D firm with great leadership.
That said, one of the things

380
00:22:52,480 --> 00:22:56,200
that I posted about I commented
on a post of hers just today on

381
00:22:56,200 --> 00:23:01,520
LinkedIn was to say Once Upon a
time, the problem was that

382
00:23:03,200 --> 00:23:08,320
figuring out how to position all
the resources needed for a team

383
00:23:09,520 --> 00:23:11,880
equidistant from the point of
need.

384
00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:15,440
Meaning it would be just as easy
to get this resource when you

385
00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:17,560
needed it as it was to get that
resource.

386
00:23:17,560 --> 00:23:21,080
Think of the person or business
in the center of a circle and

387
00:23:21,080 --> 00:23:24,000
all the resources needed to make
everything keep running smoothly

388
00:23:24,000 --> 00:23:26,840
in a circle around them.
You know, equidistant in every

389
00:23:26,840 --> 00:23:29,200
direction.
The problem was, even if you

390
00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:32,720
could set up a system like that,
you couldn't scale it because

391
00:23:34,080 --> 00:23:37,920
the knowledge that was required
of the person or the business or

392
00:23:37,920 --> 00:23:41,000
the team in the middle of the
circle at any given moment,

393
00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:43,880
depending on what was
fluctuating in their business

394
00:23:43,880 --> 00:23:47,280
world, wasn't.
That was the IECE that was

395
00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:50,080
missing.
Meaning they know there's a

396
00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:53,560
problem, they know they need to
react, but they didn't know what

397
00:23:53,560 --> 00:23:58,360
tool to use to react, how to
react, when to react, unless

398
00:23:58,360 --> 00:24:01,080
they could find that person who
had that knowledge trapped in

399
00:24:01,080 --> 00:24:04,440
their head or it was in a
learning module or etcetera.

400
00:24:04,440 --> 00:24:07,480
So you can't scale because
there's always that moment where

401
00:24:07,480 --> 00:24:10,200
you sort of jam the gears, you
know, shift up.

402
00:24:10,200 --> 00:24:11,920
You're trying to, you're trying
to upshift you.

403
00:24:11,960 --> 00:24:15,080
Bottleneck things, yeah.
Yeah, like you get this little

404
00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:17,800
bottleneck, right.
So, but now with AI and the

405
00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:22,240
tools that we have to make it
possible for on the fly people

406
00:24:22,240 --> 00:24:26,240
to ask the question that they
need answered and get the

407
00:24:26,240 --> 00:24:29,200
information that tells them
exactly what resources to tap

408
00:24:29,200 --> 00:24:31,160
into.
Now we're flying.

409
00:24:31,280 --> 00:24:32,880
Now I.
Love it.

410
00:24:33,040 --> 00:24:36,600
That's the advantage of this new
world we find ourselves in, and

411
00:24:36,600 --> 00:24:39,400
it's what we've always wanted.
We've always talked about

412
00:24:39,400 --> 00:24:43,080
creating learning paths that
were flexible and customizable

413
00:24:43,080 --> 00:24:45,560
and specific to the learner and
the need of it.

414
00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:48,600
So much work in the background.
Yeah, yeah.

415
00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:51,600
Oh my God.
To create that, Yeah, right.

416
00:24:52,400 --> 00:24:58,560
And a week, a month, a year from
now, so much has changed that

417
00:24:58,560 --> 00:25:01,920
all those mechanisms are like
train tracks leading nowhere.

418
00:25:02,080 --> 00:25:05,040
Like so all the work you did to
build it in the first place,

419
00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:10,000
you're like, well, it's hard to
convince the higher ups to throw

420
00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:12,760
that much money at the problem
to do it all over again.

421
00:25:12,760 --> 00:25:15,320
Because you see immediately,
well, we're going to be in the

422
00:25:15,320 --> 00:25:17,520
same situation.
So we have to, you know, we have

423
00:25:17,520 --> 00:25:18,800
to figure out a new way of doing
this.

424
00:25:18,800 --> 00:25:23,320
But now with the where we find
ourselves now, and this is what

425
00:25:23,320 --> 00:25:26,840
gets me excited when I see
people like you and David Kelly

426
00:25:26,840 --> 00:25:29,160
and Karen North and Tom
McDowell.

427
00:25:29,160 --> 00:25:30,840
I just read his newsletter this
morning.

428
00:25:31,200 --> 00:25:32,800
The all.
Those oh, I love Tom.

429
00:25:32,800 --> 00:25:36,920
Oh gosh, he's so great.
They're dropping these truth

430
00:25:36,920 --> 00:25:41,240
bombs, suggesting that hey,
rather than being afraid of the

431
00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:45,960
what these tools like AI can do,
get excited about how you can

432
00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:50,120
leverage those tools to do what
we've always dreamed of, right?

433
00:25:50,360 --> 00:25:54,920
Don't be afraid of the tool.
Be excited that now what we've

434
00:25:54,920 --> 00:25:58,720
always wanted to create and have
told people would be the ideal

435
00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:01,240
solution, we actually get to
here.

436
00:26:01,440 --> 00:26:04,440
Yeah, I know.
It's fantastic.

437
00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:07,680
And the thing about it is it's
like the people that are

438
00:26:07,680 --> 00:26:11,280
resisting are creating the
stigma around it that is truly

439
00:26:11,280 --> 00:26:16,080
unnecessary at 25 years into the
21st century.

440
00:26:16,560 --> 00:26:20,120
I everything that.
So I just recently, I use a tool

441
00:26:20,120 --> 00:26:24,120
called Motion.
I'm not getting any things from

442
00:26:24,120 --> 00:26:25,800
them.
I honestly have been using it

443
00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:30,720
for about a year and they just
incorporated some AI, they call

444
00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:33,280
them AI employees.
So they each do like different

445
00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:35,280
things.
And one of mine is that it

446
00:26:35,280 --> 00:26:38,360
responds to e-mail messages.
It's like it drafts it.

447
00:26:38,360 --> 00:26:41,200
It just writes a draft to the
e-mail that somebody sent me.

448
00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:45,120
And I'm like, this is a game
changer for me because I spend

449
00:26:45,120 --> 00:26:49,440
as a director so much time
curating the correct words or

450
00:26:49,440 --> 00:26:53,520
what to say or how to respond,
you know, and like, be a

451
00:26:53,520 --> 00:26:56,360
perfectionist.
And it's just saving me so much

452
00:26:56,360 --> 00:26:59,960
time.
And I'm like, one thing I really

453
00:26:59,960 --> 00:27:03,960
truly feel is that instructional
designers or people in learning

454
00:27:03,960 --> 00:27:08,440
and development now get the
space to actually be creative

455
00:27:08,840 --> 00:27:12,560
instead of worrying about the
scripting, instead of worrying

456
00:27:12,560 --> 00:27:16,840
about the, the whole like
outline of the course and trying

457
00:27:16,840 --> 00:27:20,040
to figure that out in five to
seven days or something like

458
00:27:20,040 --> 00:27:21,920
that.
Like it's already done.

459
00:27:22,160 --> 00:27:24,360
So you really get to be in that
design element.

460
00:27:24,360 --> 00:27:26,960
You really get to be in that
development piece and be super

461
00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:29,520
creative.
It's been what I've been hoping

462
00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:32,600
for and wanting for my entire
career as an instructional

463
00:27:32,600 --> 00:27:36,680
designer is something to take
off that pressure so I can sit

464
00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:40,680
in this space and just figure
out new ways to kind of tap the

465
00:27:40,680 --> 00:27:43,960
psyche, the motivation, all that
psychology stuff that goes into

466
00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:46,640
instructional design.
Yeah, yeah.

467
00:27:46,680 --> 00:27:50,400
Yeah, it's it's amazing.
I I don't know how people live

468
00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:52,440
without AI.
How, how do we do it?

469
00:27:52,640 --> 00:27:55,280
It's like before the Internet.
Yeah, yeah.

470
00:27:56,160 --> 00:27:58,360
Well.
So, so, so let, I'll add

471
00:27:58,480 --> 00:28:01,640
something to that because I
agree with that.

472
00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:05,360
But again, thinking about so
people, people who may this,

473
00:28:05,440 --> 00:28:08,680
this is the thing about change.
The thing about change is it's

474
00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:12,120
always uncomfortable, right?
The reason change is

475
00:28:12,120 --> 00:28:17,320
uncomfortable is because you are
not yet lined up with what comes

476
00:28:17,320 --> 00:28:21,400
next, right?
Being shown a new way of working

477
00:28:21,400 --> 00:28:25,120
or a new circumstance, or your
your team is being reorganized,

478
00:28:25,120 --> 00:28:29,000
or you've got a new manager.
Like all of those things feel

479
00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:33,000
uncomfortable because we put our
focus on what is different, what

480
00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:36,520
we don't have any more that we
used to have or that we knew.

481
00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:39,880
We put our focus there.
And we tell that story over and

482
00:28:39,880 --> 00:28:42,960
over again, you know, in the
break room to our wives, to, you

483
00:28:42,960 --> 00:28:46,040
know, we just, we just we just a
bit about the fact that, oh,

484
00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:47,120
they don't know what they're
doing.

485
00:28:47,120 --> 00:28:50,120
They're they're the.
Typewriter is gonna last

486
00:28:50,120 --> 00:28:52,160
forever.
It's the main.

487
00:28:52,960 --> 00:28:55,640
Yeah, yeah.
Whatever, whatever it is, just

488
00:28:55,640 --> 00:29:02,760
recognize that the change, that
what you don't hear in that in

489
00:29:02,760 --> 00:29:05,040
the complaining conversation is
this.

490
00:29:06,240 --> 00:29:10,160
That if you are fundamentally
someone who appreciates and

491
00:29:10,160 --> 00:29:14,000
understands how to get in the
minds of someone who needs to

492
00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:17,280
learn something, you are going
to be that person.

493
00:29:17,640 --> 00:29:21,840
Provided you get out of your own
way and allow yourself to lean

494
00:29:21,840 --> 00:29:26,440
into some of these new resources
and tools that business needs to

495
00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:33,640
help them create good content.
And that piece of it, that's,

496
00:29:33,640 --> 00:29:36,400
that's what you're not hearing.
You're only hearing how instead

497
00:29:36,400 --> 00:29:41,640
of me, the AI is doing all the
work.

498
00:29:41,920 --> 00:29:45,760
And the, and the answer is the
AI can do, the AI gives you that

499
00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:48,320
flexibility, right?
And I had no idea that this is

500
00:29:48,320 --> 00:29:49,640
where this conversation was
going to go.

501
00:29:49,640 --> 00:29:52,440
Me either and I but I'm loving
it so much.

502
00:29:52,680 --> 00:29:55,320
Yeah, but just, but just think
about the flexibility we were

503
00:29:55,320 --> 00:29:58,480
talking about a minute ago.
The AI is giving you the ability

504
00:29:58,480 --> 00:30:02,720
to pivot and one of the biggest
problems with old 8 L&D models

505
00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:05,400
that I'm sure many of thus
anyone who's been in the career

506
00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:07,720
for 10 years or more
understands.

507
00:30:07,880 --> 00:30:12,920
You have those projects that got
started back in the day and took

508
00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:15,480
forever.
And when it was done, you

509
00:30:15,480 --> 00:30:19,480
realized, Oh my God, if if we
were, we're launching this, but

510
00:30:19,480 --> 00:30:22,600
if we had started working on it
last month, we wouldn't be

511
00:30:22,600 --> 00:30:25,800
launching this.
We'd be creating the thing that

512
00:30:25,800 --> 00:30:28,720
we actually need, but we have to
launch this because this is

513
00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:31,800
where we spent all the money.
So we have to start tracking how

514
00:30:31,800 --> 00:30:35,160
effective it is and did it move
the needle and do we get an ROI,

515
00:30:35,160 --> 00:30:39,800
blah, blah, blah.
But the joy of thinking smaller

516
00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:43,120
and bigger at the same time is
that we have the tools that

517
00:30:43,120 --> 00:30:46,920
allow us to create the as needs
solutions when they are needed.

518
00:30:47,360 --> 00:30:51,880
And if we can all sit back and
recognize that the business

519
00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:56,200
world as our lives is moving and
changing so quickly that

520
00:30:56,200 --> 00:31:00,280
attempting to plant a flag at
any point along that journey and

521
00:31:00,280 --> 00:31:02,240
say this is where we're going to
stay and we're going to live and

522
00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:04,600
we're going to focus on this
problem and we're going to solve

523
00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:07,720
this problem is an outmoded way
of thinking.

524
00:31:08,000 --> 00:31:10,640
You have to assume that you are
you.

525
00:31:10,640 --> 00:31:12,560
We are all running.
We're all in a race.

526
00:31:12,600 --> 00:31:15,840
And the trick is to figure out
what are the small things you

527
00:31:15,840 --> 00:31:20,320
can fix fast and quickly along
the way to enable everyone else

528
00:31:20,320 --> 00:31:23,400
to keep running.
You know, just keep people from

529
00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:25,800
stumbling.
Don't worry about bringing them

530
00:31:25,800 --> 00:31:29,240
all back into the dugout and,
you know, talking to them for 45

531
00:31:29,240 --> 00:31:30,600
minutes about how to play the
game.

532
00:31:30,600 --> 00:31:33,480
No, the game goes on.
You got to fix it on the fly.

533
00:31:33,560 --> 00:31:36,680
You know what I mean?
100% And I love the baseball

534
00:31:36,680 --> 00:31:39,680
analogy because it's a fantastic
one.

535
00:31:40,200 --> 00:31:44,880
So as we're coming to wrap, this
has been a great conversation.

536
00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:48,200
I've loved what you've been
saying here, but we have a lot

537
00:31:48,200 --> 00:31:51,920
of listeners who want advice.
You know, you probably get, I'm

538
00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:55,600
just going to assume LinkedIn
messages about how you're doing

539
00:31:55,600 --> 00:31:57,640
all that you're doing and doing
it so well.

540
00:31:57,920 --> 00:32:00,800
I get tons of LinkedIn messages,
especially from transitioning

541
00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:03,840
teachers about like, how did I
get into L&D?

542
00:32:04,080 --> 00:32:07,240
How did, how do I have like this
vast network?

543
00:32:07,240 --> 00:32:10,120
Like what did I do?
Like every time somebody asks me

544
00:32:10,120 --> 00:32:13,280
that, I'm like, it's really not
just one thing, it's a, it's a

545
00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:15,880
lot of different little things.
I kind of bring it all together,

546
00:32:16,400 --> 00:32:19,440
but coming from you, I'd love to
know any advice you have for

547
00:32:19,440 --> 00:32:22,120
people who are looking to
transition into learning and

548
00:32:22,120 --> 00:32:25,720
development or start their own
business like you have.

549
00:32:26,640 --> 00:32:28,920
They really want some takeaways
like they want to listen up.

550
00:32:28,920 --> 00:32:31,240
So they're like, what are the
what are the three things we can

551
00:32:31,240 --> 00:32:37,440
do today?
Well, it's I, I appreciate the

552
00:32:37,440 --> 00:32:40,800
opportunity to speak to it.
And I just want to say upfront

553
00:32:40,920 --> 00:32:42,880
that I'm going to quote Tom
McDowell.

554
00:32:42,880 --> 00:32:47,480
As a matter of fact, I'm going
to say I'm not an expert and the

555
00:32:47,800 --> 00:32:55,640
and I don't know is a viable
answer, but but I will say I if

556
00:32:56,120 --> 00:32:59,440
for me to answer the question,
the only way I can answer it is

557
00:32:59,440 --> 00:33:02,960
from my own experience.
So it comes with that caveat,

558
00:33:02,960 --> 00:33:06,240
meaning I don't expect everyone
who's listening to this to

559
00:33:06,280 --> 00:33:10,400
necessarily line up with
everything that I think and nor

560
00:33:10,400 --> 00:33:12,320
do they find themselves in my
circumstance.

561
00:33:12,320 --> 00:33:15,240
Everyone has their own and
they're all doing the best they

562
00:33:15,240 --> 00:33:20,320
can to to work within what they
feel like are the constraints

563
00:33:20,640 --> 00:33:22,080
put upon.
Them 100%.

564
00:33:22,400 --> 00:33:27,920
So, so if you imagine yourself,
if you're not a transitioning

565
00:33:27,920 --> 00:33:30,320
teacher and you're listening to
this, just put yourself in

566
00:33:30,480 --> 00:33:32,440
there.
Put yourself in the mindset of

567
00:33:32,440 --> 00:33:34,040
someone who is in that
situation.

568
00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:39,080
You're leaving what feels like a
career that you have sunk your

569
00:33:39,080 --> 00:33:41,960
heart and soul into and
countless hours and a lot of

570
00:33:41,960 --> 00:33:46,600
your own money in the hopes of
making of helping people and

571
00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:49,720
helping people succeed.
I mean, that is the primary goal

572
00:33:49,720 --> 00:33:51,560
of teaching is that you want to
lift people up.

573
00:33:51,560 --> 00:33:54,760
You want to help people do what
they want to be able to do and

574
00:33:54,760 --> 00:33:56,240
give them good advice along the
way.

575
00:33:56,600 --> 00:34:02,600
And now you are trying to find
work in an arena where every

576
00:34:03,480 --> 00:34:07,320
like the the ecosystem of
education is nowhere to be

577
00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:11,440
found.
So all all the rules have

578
00:34:11,440 --> 00:34:14,400
changed, all the requirements
have changed, all the

579
00:34:14,400 --> 00:34:17,760
expectations have changed.
And yet the fundamental thing

580
00:34:17,760 --> 00:34:20,199
that you want to continue doing
is the same.

581
00:34:21,520 --> 00:34:24,840
So there are a lot of what I
call artificial constraints.

582
00:34:25,239 --> 00:34:30,120
Anyone can stand or sit as I am
here and say, well, if you want

583
00:34:30,120 --> 00:34:34,520
to succeed, you're going to need
to learn this and apply this and

584
00:34:34,520 --> 00:34:38,880
understand this and, and, and
basically buy into all of the

585
00:34:38,880 --> 00:34:42,199
reasons why what you do is
different, right?

586
00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:46,600
And the problem in my opinion
with that approach is that you

587
00:34:46,600 --> 00:34:49,320
will never get to where you're
trying to go.

588
00:34:49,679 --> 00:34:54,040
You will be forever trying to
learn the thing, upskill,

589
00:34:54,400 --> 00:34:58,280
acquire the knowledge, build the
reputation, etcetera, etcetera.

590
00:34:58,280 --> 00:35:01,080
You will just be on a treadmill
that never gets you where you

591
00:35:01,080 --> 00:35:04,440
want to go.
So I would say this, don't focus

592
00:35:04,440 --> 00:35:09,120
on what is different and don't
focus on what other people are

593
00:35:09,120 --> 00:35:10,960
saying that you have to do
first.

594
00:35:11,320 --> 00:35:15,880
Throw that out the window my in
my opinion, and focus and focus

595
00:35:15,880 --> 00:35:21,200
instead on the area in which you
would truly like to be teaching.

596
00:35:21,320 --> 00:35:24,480
OK, maybe you were an algebra
teacher, maybe math.

597
00:35:24,520 --> 00:35:29,360
Maybe math has been the thing
that made you excited because

598
00:35:29,360 --> 00:35:32,240
you love the solving of the
problems and you like seeing the

599
00:35:32,240 --> 00:35:35,640
light go on in people's eyes
when they realized, oh, I can

600
00:35:35,640 --> 00:35:40,880
plug anything in and it works.
You know, figure out what area

601
00:35:40,880 --> 00:35:45,080
of business is doing things that
makes you feel this way.

602
00:35:45,080 --> 00:35:49,800
You feel about your primary area
of interest, like what it is

603
00:35:49,880 --> 00:35:54,600
that you love, why you love
teaching what you teach and make

604
00:35:54,600 --> 00:36:02,120
your goal to be forming
connections with that field and

605
00:36:02,120 --> 00:36:07,360
those individual companies that
are doing that thing in the day

606
00:36:07,360 --> 00:36:13,760
of ATS and resumes being it's
like, it's like processed food,

607
00:36:13,800 --> 00:36:15,400
right?
The difference between food and

608
00:36:15,400 --> 00:36:18,920
processed food is the difference
between the resume that in that

609
00:36:19,000 --> 00:36:21,800
Once Upon a time was sort of
telling a story and then became

610
00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:25,760
a thing designed for machines to
allow a hiring person to have

611
00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:28,560
less, less, fewer resumes on
their desk, right?

612
00:36:28,560 --> 00:36:31,960
That was the goal, right?
Let me have to spend less time

613
00:36:31,960 --> 00:36:36,160
wading through my applicants
right that so so.

614
00:36:36,160 --> 00:36:38,600
So interesting to me is that
we've created these barriers

615
00:36:38,600 --> 00:36:41,520
that people have created
companies for to overcome these

616
00:36:41,640 --> 00:36:43,640
barriers.
So there's ATS companies,

617
00:36:43,920 --> 00:36:46,080
companies that focus on the fact
that you can't get through an

618
00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:48,360
ATS system and you pay them to
figure out how to.

619
00:36:48,960 --> 00:36:51,040
Yeah.
Anyways, that's a conversation

620
00:36:51,040 --> 00:36:53,000
for another day, but that
bothers me.

621
00:36:53,120 --> 00:36:55,520
Absolutely, absolutely.
And but the, But the point here

622
00:36:55,520 --> 00:36:58,800
is that if you focus on the
problem, if you focus on the

623
00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:03,840
obstacle, you will forever be
focused on, you will forever be

624
00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:06,120
dealing with the obstacle and
the problem because there's

625
00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:09,120
always another way to try and
solve that problem, right?

626
00:37:09,320 --> 00:37:12,400
Because some you know, you, you,
as you said, the companies are

627
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:16,280
lining up people on LinkedIn,
people on social media lining up

628
00:37:16,520 --> 00:37:19,560
to give you the plan that
guarantees that you will be able

629
00:37:19,560 --> 00:37:23,280
to jump all of the hurdles as
the hurdles keep client keep

630
00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:25,120
getting higher and higher and
higher, right.

631
00:37:25,880 --> 00:37:29,760
So my feeling has been I look at
my past, I look at my journey

632
00:37:29,800 --> 00:37:33,160
and I say, when did my moments
of success happen?

633
00:37:33,360 --> 00:37:36,520
How did they happen?
What, what were they the result

634
00:37:36,520 --> 00:37:38,680
of me efforting my way into the
room?

635
00:37:39,200 --> 00:37:43,240
Or did they happen because
suddenly a door opened?

636
00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:48,080
Because I was fully, because I
was so focused on the thing that

637
00:37:48,080 --> 00:37:50,720
I wanted to do and was excited
about that.

638
00:37:50,720 --> 00:37:52,520
People came in to see what I was
doing.

639
00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:56,040
The door opened and people came
in, People came to me.

640
00:37:56,480 --> 00:37:59,800
I'll use another acting analogy.
The difference between stage

641
00:37:59,800 --> 00:38:04,680
acting and being on camera has
to do with whether you are

642
00:38:05,360 --> 00:38:08,560
putting yourself out there far
enough for the audience to feel

643
00:38:08,560 --> 00:38:14,880
like they're inside you in a
play, and being so at one with

644
00:38:14,880 --> 00:38:19,400
who you are that the audience
gets pulled into you when you're

645
00:38:19,400 --> 00:38:23,160
on camera.
OK, so I'm going to say think of

646
00:38:23,160 --> 00:38:28,320
yourself as a movie star less
than a Shakespearean actor.

647
00:38:29,160 --> 00:38:32,800
Don't be worried so much about
what you're putting out so that

648
00:38:33,200 --> 00:38:36,440
people see you the way you think
they need to see you based on

649
00:38:36,440 --> 00:38:39,440
your ever changing thoughts and
what you're being told about

650
00:38:39,440 --> 00:38:43,240
what they need to see.
IE putting yourself in the box

651
00:38:43,240 --> 00:38:45,960
someone else created when they
don't even know themselves what

652
00:38:45,960 --> 00:38:47,880
needs to be in it, but they're
happy to tell you.

653
00:38:47,880 --> 00:38:52,040
You have to align with all those
things and instead focus on what

654
00:38:52,040 --> 00:38:54,480
brings you joy.
And that's going to be really

655
00:38:54,480 --> 00:38:57,880
uncomfortable.
It could be very uncomfortable

656
00:38:57,880 --> 00:39:01,040
to change your focus that much
and to really start spending

657
00:39:01,040 --> 00:39:04,360
time with yourself and asking
yourself if I didn't have to

658
00:39:04,360 --> 00:39:06,160
worry about what anybody else
thought of me.

659
00:39:06,160 --> 00:39:08,360
If I didn't have to worry about
what anybody else said I should

660
00:39:08,360 --> 00:39:09,880
be doing.
If I didn't have to worry about

661
00:39:09,880 --> 00:39:13,680
following all of these rules,
all of these rules, what would I

662
00:39:13,680 --> 00:39:15,400
do?
What would I want to?

663
00:39:15,400 --> 00:39:17,400
Be my God, I'm super inspired
right now.

664
00:39:18,880 --> 00:39:21,920
Need to reflect more.
Yeah, well, that's and that's

665
00:39:22,160 --> 00:39:26,320
it.
That's it, man, slipping into

666
00:39:26,320 --> 00:39:30,640
my, as people say to me often.
You said people reach out to you

667
00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:32,640
and ask you questions about this
stuff all the time, right.

668
00:39:32,640 --> 00:39:35,600
I'm like, people reach out to me
and say you're a little rough

669
00:39:35,600 --> 00:39:37,280
around the edges, but I like
that about you.

670
00:39:40,240 --> 00:39:41,880
I don't think it'd be like that
at all.

671
00:39:42,720 --> 00:39:44,560
I really don't I.
Really.

672
00:39:45,280 --> 00:39:47,160
Don't, but that's funny that
they say that.

673
00:39:47,320 --> 00:39:49,480
But the reflection, you are
absolutely right.

674
00:39:49,480 --> 00:39:50,840
And that is really the heart of
it.

675
00:39:50,920 --> 00:39:57,800
And and more than any other
thing like sure, I could say go

676
00:39:57,800 --> 00:40:01,360
where?
Go where there are fewer people,

677
00:40:02,960 --> 00:40:07,640
meaning don't stand in the
largest crowd and expect to be

678
00:40:07,640 --> 00:40:12,000
spotted right.
And don't think, don't think of

679
00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:17,920
companies as fortresses.
Companies are made-up of people,

680
00:40:18,840 --> 00:40:23,400
and they're just like we know
now that everything that appears

681
00:40:23,400 --> 00:40:26,960
to be solid matter is actually
made-up of atoms that,

682
00:40:27,120 --> 00:40:30,480
relatively speaking, are miles
apart from each other inside

683
00:40:30,480 --> 00:40:32,600
this thing.
Anything we, you know, the table

684
00:40:32,640 --> 00:40:36,120
in front of me, I tap, it feels
solid, but it's actually empty

685
00:40:36,120 --> 00:40:39,120
space.
It's mostly empty space made-up

686
00:40:39,120 --> 00:40:44,560
of individual atoms.
Well, companies are made-up of a

687
00:40:44,560 --> 00:40:49,160
lot of space that exists between
the people that run them and

688
00:40:49,160 --> 00:40:52,720
everybody has a job to do.
So when you see a social media

689
00:40:52,720 --> 00:40:55,440
post, for example, don't think
of it as the voice of the

690
00:40:55,440 --> 00:40:57,840
company, even though that's what
the company wants you to think.

691
00:40:57,840 --> 00:41:01,000
The company doesn't want there
to be any personal association

692
00:41:01,000 --> 00:41:03,360
with an individual.
They want to say this, this is

693
00:41:03,360 --> 00:41:08,120
our mask, this is our, this is
our, our, our map to for

694
00:41:08,120 --> 00:41:11,280
success.
This is what we do a large scale

695
00:41:11,280 --> 00:41:15,200
structures, etcetera.
But the reality is, is there,

696
00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:18,080
there's somebody who worked till
8:00 last night to make sure

697
00:41:18,080 --> 00:41:21,320
that that post went out and
looked the way it did and made

698
00:41:21,320 --> 00:41:24,760
the last minute correction that
their CEO demanded, etcetera,

699
00:41:24,760 --> 00:41:27,360
etcetera, etcetera.
Talk to the company like you

700
00:41:27,360 --> 00:41:30,120
were talking to the people in
the company.

701
00:41:31,280 --> 00:41:34,240
I have had so, so much of my
success.

702
00:41:34,240 --> 00:41:37,640
I have not, I have not.
Like, it's not like I carved it

703
00:41:37,640 --> 00:41:41,800
out of the rock with a pickaxe.
Like I'm, I'm, I don't, I don't

704
00:41:41,800 --> 00:41:44,600
like sweating, you know, I
don't, I don't want to work

705
00:41:44,680 --> 00:41:49,320
really hard on things that don't
immediately give me a sense of

706
00:41:49,320 --> 00:41:51,800
joy as I'm working on them,
right?

707
00:41:52,160 --> 00:41:55,800
Efforting is not my way.
But when I look back at any

708
00:41:55,800 --> 00:41:59,400
success that I've had, I
recognize it's because I have

709
00:41:59,400 --> 00:42:06,160
allowed, I have allowed the
connection that led to the

710
00:42:06,160 --> 00:42:09,720
opportunity that led to the
success.

711
00:42:10,640 --> 00:42:13,200
And we all need to be, I think,
working harder.

712
00:42:14,040 --> 00:42:15,920
Not, you know, joke tongue in
cheek.

713
00:42:15,920 --> 00:42:22,840
We need to be working harder at
allowing those connections to

714
00:42:22,840 --> 00:42:25,560
happen.
Yeah, 100%.

715
00:42:26,320 --> 00:42:28,120
James, this has been a great
episode.

716
00:42:28,440 --> 00:42:31,840
I've really enjoyed this.
Tell people where they can

717
00:42:31,840 --> 00:42:33,600
connect with you.
Where can they find you?

718
00:42:35,480 --> 00:42:38,600
So it's a great example of not
doing things the traditional

719
00:42:38,600 --> 00:42:42,720
way.
I started Lighthouse L&D

720
00:42:42,720 --> 00:42:47,880
consulting because someone
wanted to work with me and they

721
00:42:47,880 --> 00:42:53,920
assumed and they assumed that
they could because they figured

722
00:42:53,920 --> 00:42:57,840
I had to be offering my services
out as a consultant.

723
00:42:58,720 --> 00:43:01,800
And so I immediately said, yes,
that is exactly right.

724
00:43:02,240 --> 00:43:06,120
And my company is called this
and I will be happy to work with

725
00:43:06,120 --> 00:43:09,040
you.
And then I had to go create my

726
00:43:09,040 --> 00:43:11,240
company.
I had to create.

727
00:43:11,280 --> 00:43:13,560
I had to create a presence.
I had to create a brand.

728
00:43:13,760 --> 00:43:15,360
I had to think about what I
wanted to do.

729
00:43:15,600 --> 00:43:18,680
Now, that isn't to say that two
weeks prior to that, I hadn't

730
00:43:18,680 --> 00:43:22,360
stood in my living room and said
to my amazing wife, Julie

731
00:43:22,360 --> 00:43:26,800
Sherwood, that all the things
that I was not going to do

732
00:43:26,800 --> 00:43:29,680
anymore, the things I was not
happy about, the things the box

733
00:43:29,680 --> 00:43:32,400
I didn't want to put myself into
and what I did want.

734
00:43:32,680 --> 00:43:36,280
I just did a tirade to the
universe about what I want and

735
00:43:36,280 --> 00:43:40,000
what I don't want.
And that, in my opinion, is what

736
00:43:40,400 --> 00:43:42,720
that was the door.
That was the door that opened.

737
00:43:42,880 --> 00:43:46,160
I opened it for myself.
I said I'm going to allow myself

738
00:43:46,160 --> 00:43:49,840
to believe that I can do what I
want and not do the stuff I

739
00:43:49,840 --> 00:43:51,840
don't want to do.
And two weeks later, somebody's

740
00:43:51,840 --> 00:43:54,920
reaching out to me, assuming I
have a business and wanting to

741
00:43:54,920 --> 00:43:57,000
pay me.
Yeah, that's.

742
00:43:57,920 --> 00:43:59,760
Awesome, so I don't have a
website.

743
00:43:59,800 --> 00:44:02,320
I still don't have a website.
I've been doing this for 2 1/2

744
00:44:02,320 --> 00:44:05,480
years and the only place that I
ever the the where I like to

745
00:44:05,480 --> 00:44:08,360
focus is LinkedIn.
So I put all of my time and

746
00:44:08,360 --> 00:44:13,240
energy on LinkedIn so people can
find me at my LinkedIn address,

747
00:44:13,240 --> 00:44:16,480
which is basically the LinkedIn
URL plus James we're.

748
00:44:16,480 --> 00:44:18,880
Gonna have it.
All OK.

749
00:44:18,960 --> 00:44:20,640
Yeah.
Yeah, it's all gonna be there

750
00:44:20,640 --> 00:44:22,520
for you.
So I'm so glad that you're out

751
00:44:22,520 --> 00:44:26,120
of LinkedIn world.
It, it, it, it's a great space.

752
00:44:26,280 --> 00:44:29,480
It's, you know, some people kind
of bashed on it, but I don't

753
00:44:29,480 --> 00:44:31,800
know where I'd be without
LinkedIn at this point in the

754
00:44:31,800 --> 00:44:34,960
community and the support and
all the people that are there.

755
00:44:34,960 --> 00:44:38,840
I don't think I would truly be
motivated to go and do these

756
00:44:38,840 --> 00:44:41,640
things you're say doing like
find your passions, don't do the

757
00:44:41,640 --> 00:44:43,440
things you don't want to do, do
the things you want to do.

758
00:44:43,880 --> 00:44:46,320
It's just, it's so
inspirational.

759
00:44:46,600 --> 00:44:50,000
So thank you so much for coming
on the show and sharing your

760
00:44:50,000 --> 00:44:53,000
experiences and talking with all
these different things about us.

761
00:44:53,440 --> 00:44:57,160
I know the audience is like
probably like, wow right now and

762
00:44:57,160 --> 00:44:58,680
they want to come out and talk
to you.

763
00:44:58,680 --> 00:45:01,720
And everything will be in the
show notes about how to connect

764
00:45:01,720 --> 00:45:04,800
with James out on LinkedIn.
And of course, if you have

765
00:45:04,800 --> 00:45:06,840
questions, reach out to me,
reach out to him.

766
00:45:06,840 --> 00:45:10,800
We're happy to to support you if
you're making this transition

767
00:45:10,800 --> 00:45:13,320
into L&D.
So, James, thanks so much for

768
00:45:13,320 --> 00:45:16,640
coming on the show.
My absolute pleasure.

769
00:45:16,640 --> 00:45:20,320
Thank you for the questions.
That's why I like to do podcasts

770
00:45:20,320 --> 00:45:23,080
because I never know what I'm
going to say and I don't know

771
00:45:23,080 --> 00:45:26,480
what I think until I say it.
So you've just given me more

772
00:45:26,480 --> 00:45:29,720
clarity, which I love, and I
just want to double down and

773
00:45:29,720 --> 00:45:32,360
repeat what you just said to
anyone listening to the show

774
00:45:33,520 --> 00:45:36,160
you.
What if you have a question?

775
00:45:36,200 --> 00:45:39,160
If you feel like you should be
closer to the answer than you

776
00:45:39,160 --> 00:45:43,080
are, and you want to reach out
to someone and get help, Holly

777
00:45:43,080 --> 00:45:46,320
is an amazing person to talk to.
I am happy to talk to you.

778
00:45:46,600 --> 00:45:49,880
The field of L&D is full of
generous people, and the only

779
00:45:49,880 --> 00:45:52,680
thing standing between you and
getting those answers is your

780
00:45:52,680 --> 00:45:55,680
willingness to ask for the help
that you need.

781
00:45:56,000 --> 00:45:58,560
Absolutely, absolutely.
Well said.

782
00:45:59,520 --> 00:46:02,560
Thanks, Holly.
Hi, we're Ice Spring, an

783
00:46:02,560 --> 00:46:05,480
international team of e-learning
enthusiasts who help more than

784
00:46:05,480 --> 00:46:09,000
60,000 clients across the globe
succeed with better online

785
00:46:09,000 --> 00:46:11,440
learning.
Our two flagship solutions are

786
00:46:11,440 --> 00:46:14,120
ispring Suite and ispring Learn
LMS.

787
00:46:14,520 --> 00:46:16,534
Ispring Suite is an intuitive,
all in

788
00:46:29,520 --> 00:46:33,720
Go to www.ispringsolutions.com
to learn more about us and

789
00:46:33,720 --> 00:46:36,360
connect.
Thanks for spending a few

790
00:46:36,360 --> 00:46:38,680
minutes with Holly.
She knows your podcast queue is

791
00:46:38,680 --> 00:46:41,400
packed.
If today's episode sparked an

792
00:46:41,400 --> 00:46:45,600
idea or gave you that extra
nudge of confidence, tap, follow

793
00:46:45,800 --> 00:46:49,280
or subscribe in your favorite
app so you never miss an episode

794
00:46:49,280 --> 00:46:52,560
of Ed Up L&D.
Dropping a quick rating or

795
00:46:52,560 --> 00:46:56,040
review helps more educators and
learning pros discover the show,

796
00:46:56,040 --> 00:46:58,000
too.
Want to keep the conversation

797
00:46:58,000 --> 00:47:00,280
going?
Connect with Holly on LinkedIn

798
00:47:00,360 --> 00:47:02,600
and share your biggest take away
she reads.

799
00:47:02,600 --> 00:47:05,440
Every message.
Until next time, keep learning,

800
00:47:05,520 --> 00:47:08,080
keep leading, and keep believing
in your own story.

801
00:47:08,560 --> 00:47:09,040
Talk soon.