64: The Main Bird Behind it All and the Flock that Makes it Fly, A Quacktastic Chat with Andrew Cross, CEO and Founder of Goosechase

0:06 Welcome back to America's leading higher education, podcast Network. The edip Experience where we make education your business. This is Ed up edtech dedicated to interviewing leaders at the front, end of technology and innovation in education hosted by the amazing, the outstanding. The Able Holly Owens. Now let's get to it and hear from your host Holly Owens. But first, a quick word from this episode sponsor colleges and universities shouldn't have to choose between rare credible, resources and Innovative technology with Gail. You can offer Both academic Librarians across the globe Hartman with Gail, to connect students and faculty to authoritative digital sources with built-in tools, the drive effective research and learning with Gail primary sources. Scholars, can explore full-text searchable, archives covering literary political and social topics of the last 500 years. Combining these exclusive sources with a powerful tool. I Gael digital scholar lab empowers researchers to a Actively analyze texts and make new discoveries. Push past the boundaries of traditional research, expand the possibilities of digital

1:38 Humanities and Advance the skills of every learner with Gail learn how you can make knowledge, more accessible across campus at girl.com GA Ellie.com all by calling, 1-800 870 Gail. Hello everyone and welcome to another amazing episode of add up, Ed Tech, my name is Holly Owens and I'm your host. And today we have a repeat, Ed Tech Tool, but we have a brand-new, guess it is Andrew cross and he is the founder and CEO of goose. Chase Andrew. Welcome to the show. Thanks Holly I'm excited to be here.

2:20 I'm really excited to talk to you. And you know talk more about goose And what you been up to? It's been almost a year since we talked about goose, chase on oedipa Tech. So before we jump into that, I want to know more about your journey into the space. So tell us how did you get started? Everybody's Road seems to be pretty windy when it comes to Ed Tech, but we want to know your story. So let the audience know what your journey has been. Like, yeah, you're pretty spot-on. So it's a windy one. So I back in University, I studied mechanical engineering and I kind of laugh now because at High School Cool. I said, that's what I was going to do and people kind of looked at me, like you're doing what, because I was really mechanically inclined or anything like that. Interesting.

3:02 And sure enough I got into it and I like, I like some of the stuff but there's some parts that just weren't resonating with me. And, you know, I could force myself through some of the stuff, but the, the joy, it just wasn't there for me. And after an internship at a company where, when I started I was like, that's it, I made it. This is where I'm going to be for the rest of my life surprised. I didn't actually like it that much so I can't. A new idea to mix it up at that point. And I actually, for my last internship took a job at an act development shop in Toronto, and I just loved it. So, apparently software is what I needed all along, because the, the quick iteration Cycles, you know, the speed of it, all actually really, really resonated with me. And it was after that, that I went to in entrepreneurship focused residence for my final semester at University and that's actually where goose, chase started. So goose chase a story and my story actually start in the education world.

3:54 Old. And ironically our first customer was actually going to the University of Waterloo as well so I'm pretty much every single way. My journey in Goose chases Journey come from an education kind of focus background. They wanted to use it for an onboarding experience but not exactly classroom learning but it's pretty funny. How many different ways? You know, my journey and the roundabout, the the detours, all kind of go through an education world and took us a little while to go beyond the university orientation weeks. We were used for team building an early day. As well. But we actually worked with Phil Everson early on and his mom and sister were teachers. So it really kind of the through line of Education, really is there throughout most of the journey and a lot of different ways which is really quite cool. And I got to say the education space, I've been probably some of the vote most vocal users of the most engaged users through. No, not not.

4:45 Say all right. Yeah. I know. I know, I can, I can kind of figure on that one. Yes. Yes, it's been kind of cool. Honestly, the whole way through its It's there's been a lot of an edu Focus even though we aren't you necessarily only in the education space but it's a pretty dominant story line throughout as well. And that's what I love about. Goose chases, the versatility of it and not just being something education, but I can do really great things in education. So I want to know from you. Do you have any sort of educational related quotes or quotes in general that motivate you or is anyone along the path that you want to shout out? Helped you, and you can do both or you can do one or the other totally up to you.

5:29 Yeah. So one thing that I didn't actually know the formal quote for a long time and I think it's Einstein's, maybe it's once you stop learning, you start dying, which sounds really really morbid. But for me I wake up and I'm so focused on learning. Like we've done our four-day Work Week here and I find a wake up on Fridays and I'm like, cool. What can I learn today about random stuff? So it's something that very relevant to To me, as soon as I stop learning, I can start getting bored. So maybe that I would tweak it to be once you stop learning get bored just to make it not so morbid but yeah that that's a good modification. Yeah a great modification. Yeah you know but also as you grow older that that kind of mortality comes into play and my grandmother.

6:15 She actually you reminded me of something. She tells us all the time she's 81 years old, she still Bowl, she just very active and she tells us all Time. She's like, I'm not getting old because once I stop moving, I'm getting old. There you go. Exactly it, actually. So my grandmother used to go for a walk every single morning, and so I think probably they grew up with the same belief system or whatever that might be. So yeah, I think that's it. And you know, I also think Gus about who inspired me and I'm very oriented to learn by doing. I never understood people who could just kind of listen to something and then they understand everything about it and thinking back about my education. Ocean. I remember those a few teachers that went above and beyond like we had a competition and something physics class where we built cardboard boats, and we paddled them erase across the pool and things that I can remember. So vividly compared to really not remembering that much else from the class and massive Kudos an appreciation for the teachers, who kind of went above and beyond for me there to give me a little bit more of a visceral interactive experience. And it's so funny for me saying that now, Because it's only relatively recently about even connected the dots that goose chase is all about interactive experiences and learning that way.

7:32 Like of course, this is what I end up working in because this is what I remember, this is my learning style so I think it's kind of a interesting learning for me there but also huge thank you for, you know, my teachers, who did that little bit of extra effort to provide a more engaging and enjoyable learning opportunity for me? Yeah, definitely years later. You're still remembering that activity now and that's An educator can ask for really is that the students remember that will that moment they can relate it back and your journey is. So interwoven into education, it sounds like you've had a great journey there. Before we get into your definition, I absolutely love the goose chase. I'm completely biased towards it. I'm going to admit that on there because it's one of my top.

8:15 Favorite Ed Tech tools recently, we use goose chase at Amazon all site and we had a blast and most of the people that I work with, they didn't know. Got it and I'm like, this is you guys this is a thing. Like, you can have fun activities with your friends. I'm like, you can. This is not just a professional thing, it can be a personal thing. It can be, do it with your family kind of thing. So I want to shout that out that this product is just so diverse and I'll stop there. I have more for later. So I just can't help, but I love it so much and I know the audience knows when I start going off in a tangent or like I can tell Holly's, really biased to this and I'm sorry, but I am, it's just a thanks. Joseph, he called it, you Advice of friends. I think it's very good. Yeah, fully owning my bias right now and I love it. So being that you're this great CEO and your founder of goose chase, how would you personally Define educational technology. Yeah, it's a good question and I think my definition is maybe a little bit more on the generic side at least at a high level. But for me educational technology is just technology that creates Better Learning outcomes at the end of the day. And ideally it's making people's lives easier and more enjoyable as we go about doing that.

9:29 I think just better learning outcomes on its own, without any kind of fun along the way, still effective. But, you know, were kind of a fun car. Restore feel like we're only doing half the job but for me, if there's a Better Learning outcomes in some shape or form that's being created or facilitated through technology, that's like a perfect definition of that. I think can be on both sides ideally, where the educator and the student benefit but even if it's just one side of the other that somehow leads towards that better outcome I think it's a big one there. That's a great definition, a lot of people like I love this question but I don't know how to explain it. And for me if somebody asked me that question I I'd probably just talk for like 10 minutes because there's so many different components of it, but I loved how you just took it to that top level.

10:15 That was a really great General, but yet specific definition of Ed Tech, love it. All right, so for anybody in the audience, who has not heard about goose, chase or have see my LinkedIn posts or have participated in an activity that I do with goose. Chase with my learner's. Can you tell us what is goose, chase. What kind of product is it in? And how you help institutions, and organizations and education and anywhere else. Yeah, absolutely. So goose chase is a platform that enables Educators and school administrators to create interactive experiences for their students and their wider School communities looking just at the classroom Goose, chases essentially the opposite of traditional teaching methods, instead of a teacher lecturing to a class.

11:03 Goose, chase enables, this two-way conversation between the educator and the learner that as I mentioned before, just happens to be a ton of fun. And honestly, from our perspective, The fun is the essential part. I think when you are having fun, you're engaging with the content. When you're engaging with the content you're learning and you're remembering it retaining, the content. And our experience is really do. Encourage students to get in there identify with what's going on, you know, show what they know it can be through our text based answers, create a photos and videos, which are my personal favorite because you can actually let the kind of creative juices run wild. That was our final so they are you probably have With the Amazon event.

11:44 Recent yes, yes we incorporated all different types of fun things. Yeah, and we have location check-ins as well. Which I do aren't used maybe as frequently, but I think leverage they can be pretty powerful as well, combined with the other things. So she in the edu world at the end of the day, it's all about giving students, these like immersive, Active Learning experiences. I've already mentioned up a little bit biased to these active learning experiences but we don't really we both have bias on. Let's see. Yeah, there we go. You're in a safe space here. Thank you. I appreciate it, but I think it really does make a difference in your attention and understanding and the enjoyment. And as you mentioned as well, if you can use it for more than just a pure education, whether it's, you know, the PD days, the Parent-Teacher conferences or extracurricular activities, there's so many different ways it can be applied, which is really, really, really interesting.

12:35 I really think that you're what you're saying here about the fun and learning like that's, you know, when the Educators having fun and the students are having fun that He's learning because that's the times in the classroom that I enjoyed the most and the assessment scores would go up because of that, not that I don't like standardized testing, but just to see that consequence. That positive consequence of having fun and learning and experience that they got loved it because who wants to like you said, I'm the same way as you. I can't sit and listen to a lecture and retain anything. It's like it's in one ear and out the other. Like I might retain a little bit but I don't know about some of the list. Owners if that's their preferred method of learning. But that's really difficult for me. I'm like, you, I have to play with the tool. I have to interact with it.

13:21 I have to have a model and then kind of do it myself. So, that's something to be said, you know, there are a lot of people who have to learn that way. 100%, And I think that's part of why it's so fun for us to do what we do and that we're literally giving people the tools to create these incredible experiences for other people. Like it doesn't really get that much better than that from our perspective. And obviously you know, creating a participating in the experiences is perhaps even more fun but it's a pretty cool world we're creating leverage or allowing people to create good in the world and create positive experiences. Like that's awesome. Love it. I absolutely love it. And I kind of wish goose, chase was around when I was a teacher in a classroom, a minute ago because I totally would have used it with my students.

14:08 It, oh my gosh, it would have been so much fun but now I'm using it with grad students so it's totally cool. I get to use it now, thank you for sharing that and I hope people will go out and check out goose chase because it is so much fun. Now one thing I do have to ask you about Gucci, do you guys have a four-day work week? Colleges and universities no longer have to choose between rare credible, resources and Innovative technology academic Librarians across the globe partner with Gail to connect students and faculty to digital sources with built-in features that drive effective research and learning from interdisciplinary databases to interactive instruction tools.

14:49 You can make knowledge more accessible across campus with Gail learn how at Gail.com GA Ellie.com. We do. Yeah. How is that working? Because I know a lot of people in the Ed Tech sector, they work a lot of hours and sometimes on the weekends and how is your team adjusting to that and overall productivity? Because I think people have this misconception that if you have a four-day work week or you know you people that extra day on the weekend, that productivity might decrease. Definitely in the states were always like you work all the time because working all the time means, productivity is high. So how's that working out? Yeah, it's something I'm really passionate about because I'm someone who can go full out for a little bit and then I stopped and then I need to do something.

15:35 I feel like we're Twins and I have a twin already feel like we're twins. I'm the same way, but I got into the the workplace and do my method of doing work or whatever it was before, it was very much that style and I figured out how to make it work for me and do much of it was just being present at a certain place in time and it wasn't really focused on me actually getting getting things done that I needed to get done and it always kind of stuck with me and it took me a while I guess maybe to get the courage up to try it. Where it's saying okay let's disconnect. You know the time spent in our chair from this formal schedule and focus on just getting the things done that need to be done and I would say it's not this magic bullet that you start the four-day week and there's confetti cannons and everything going. Right left and Center it takes really there wasn't. I know it kind of me too.

16:27 It's it requires more discipline. I would say you need to make sure that when you're on you're on and when you're off your off, otherwise you can get into this weird hybrid Zone customer-facing, roles, there's a little bit more creativity that's needed to make sure we still work in a 5-day week businessweek world so there's more creativity but at the end of the day our productivity is where we want it to be. It's the same if not better than before. You know on average across the board. You know the mental freshness that the team has is way way way. We better especially Monday mornings. We've had somebody internally say like I don't have the Monday morning dread anymore just because I get to come and get to work and I get to do my thing, you do on the weekend and I come back fresh. So I would strongly recommend it. Especially if it's a situation where people have creative work and that they can be fresh jump into it, do their work and then they can kind of step out.

17:19 Obviously some rolls, maybe not as an edible as others, but I really think if people have discipline to be on and do really good work and then In fact it's a really powerful tool when organization. Yeah, I think so too. And I agree with you because it feels like when Friday comes and you're off work at like five honestly my clock is like done by 3:00 4:00 on Friday like I'm, that's it. Yeah. But it is generous for some people, you know, it's to make it to three or four is pretty good on Friday, right? Yeah, yeah. And I commend myself for, you know, making it making it that far and just doing like little things put emails to come up. Like Monday. So I don't see them over the weekend, but I can just imagine how your team feels.

18:02 They feel refreshed and recuperate because Friday comes in, it's like, oh my gosh, it's Sunday afternoon and you know, a lot of people talk about the Sunday scare. He's only been like going back. Like everybody dreads Mondays, but it sounds like your team is like refreshed and ready to go. Yeah. Yeah it really is. It's nice to see people excited on Monday morning. It really is. That's good and I bet there's there's a lot of great conversations too because I Feel Like Mondays like I'm just starting to get my traction and I don't know the listeners how you all can relate. Like it takes me about two Wednesday. There's like this bell curve of like productivity and I made an infographic one time. Holly's productivity bell curve him like Wednesdays and Thursdays were like at the top it goes up Monday Tuesday's and then it's going down, Thursday Friday. That's interesting.

18:50 I'm curious what the average person to be like that. Feeling that that's not something I like that. Yeah I just love that. You're doing that for your team and and creating that type of culture. Thank you. Appreciate ya. Alright, so last time Joe and Eric were on the show, like I said, episode 7 and that was recorded back in February of 2021, but released in March. So go check out that episode. So what's happened in the past year and then what's On the road map for the upcoming year, share anything, you're the founder and the CEO. So you can violate India is not get in trouble, right? I was going to say the first thing off the toppings, you know, we do try to find the right balance of giving people Vision into where we're trying to go but also to make sure our product team is covered.

19:36 We don't commit to certain deadlines or specific features because so much of what we do is Generation based and we learn what works, what doesn't work, and then change. So, in order to be flexible going forward, we do kind of approach it that way. I would say a lot of the last year has been about building out our foundation and that's kind of across the board. So we come from a more, scavenger hunt, based background and going forward were kind of relaxing. A lot of the rules that the platform is built on to allow more flexible experiences, going forward and just inherently a lot of that is like work under the surface to build, a more kind of flexible platform for everything that we're trying to build out.

20:17 You'll notice we've Put your kind of an updated brand, refresh going forward. So a lot of it is actually perfect. Definitely noticed that as a bias. Yeah, goose chase. I'd notice all those changes. Yeah. So it's it's sometimes a bit unglamorous to be like, well, we're building out the foundation but at the same time we'd been around for ten plus years and we want to be around for a lot longer. So this last year was very much building out our team flushing out the foundation, the kind of unsung stuff that provides the keys going forward. And then now that we're kind of looking into 2023, what we got is, Homemade focuses that were really dialed in on. So, the first focus is that we're building out first ever Community focused on interactive experiences exclusive exclusively. So this is honestly something people have been asking out for. I want to say our entire existence but we have these creators across the board education and otherwise who are just so motivated and energized that they want to learn from each other.

21:12 They want to become inspired. They want to connect with each other. So our goal is community is for Amal Community is really to provide a space for you all that learning and sharing and teaching to happen. And part of this is we really want to see ourselves as champion of interactive experiences you know as a whole this isn't a like goose chase goose, chase goose, chase Community. This is here's a place that creators want to create these incredible experiences can come together and learn from each other. And then obviously that's kind of the name of the game that we're playing and but we don't win by making it all about us. We win by making experiences. On this tool that more and more people appreciate. And that's going to move the whole Space forward. So that's kind of the first main focus for us there have. Did you ever work for Disney?

21:58 I have a quick question because you talk about experiences a lot, and that's what Disney is. It's a whole experience. I was related back to that, I think that's awesome. It's about the experiences, it's about the community and building the community. Yeah, it's so I never work for Disney but we had to get away from calling things games internally so it's been, yeah, he's into me and everyone in internally that we need to talk about experiences instead of games. So I'm just very experienced oriented in the first place. So it really wasn't difficult for me to switch the language of things over. But at the end of the day, it's what we do is what we care about. I'm a product person on my core. So a lot of my day is spent thinking about experiences in some shape or form. Absolutely, I'm sorry to interrupt you because what you were saying I was just thinking about walking into one of their parks and that's like how goose chase experiences. It sucks you right in and it's fun and Technology. A Fades away because you're just having such a good time and it's so easy to use.

22:52 Yeah. And I think that's honestly how the best products work as well, you know, it's not just Disney, it's the best products allow you to do what you're coming to do in just they support you but they get out of the way at the right time. So it's it's a great thing to strive for. So if we can be anything like Disney in that context, very down for that comparison to beat to be brought forward for sure. And I directed you, did you remember what you're going to say? Say, I'm so sorry. No, it's okay. I'm just going to mention that. The second Focus for us is now that we're, you know, laying the foundation. We want to keep expanding the product. We know, we have this scavenger hunt background, but there's so much more you want to do from a flexibility standpoint.

23:35 We're on the types of experiences. They can create. I'm not going to tease any specific features but there's a lot of things we're working on that are very frequently asked for especially around how experiences can. Us kind of from the start of an experience to finish. So I won't flush that out too much. But now that sound what? That sounds intriguing. You probably have the Intrigue right now. Hopefully, in the coming year, when things go out the door, you'll be like, okay. I see it. I see what the hint was there. So, yeah. Hopefully like you said, I can probably get away with breaking a few things here, so, I'll tease that the flow is probably one of the big areas that we focus on. I'm excited giving more.

24:18 Ability for how people want the way experience move. So it's play out there. Absolutely that. I'm looking forward to that, I can't wait to see what happens. Thank you for sharing and be willing to share some upcoming things for the year. I know I appreciate in, so so does the audience. But we're coming here to the final couple minutes of the episode and I have two final questions for you. I want to know, is there anything we missed? And actually it's really three questions. That's one question with two and then another question. And so anything we missed anything else, you'd like to share with the audience and I want you to be a fortune teller and I want you to put your very cool fortune, tellers hat on and tell us what the future of Ed Tech looks like. So do we miss anything?

25:05 And what does the future look like? Yeah. So I wouldn't say we missed anything major here. The one thing that I just always want to add and I'm gonna put on my Disney had again, is I think people can sometimes X forget, you know how impactful good experiences are and I mean that both good and bad experiences and how much they can impact our mood, Our Lives, what our days are like. So just on a purely personal note, I think it's a really cool experience for me to help. Create better experiences for everybody out there in the world. So that's the only thing that I would maybe highlight a little bit more explicitly compared to what I've done before. And then you looking at the future of edtech, fortune-telling is always hard here at the same. I'm I think it were a spot now where the future of attack is really overflowing with possibilities. I think we're in an interesting spot as well. And that teachers are looking now for ways to make lessons more engaging.

26:00 And they're actually eager to adopt new technologies and not that they weren't before. But I think it's more accessible sometimes for teachers and bring technology into the classroom or wherever else. It might come in and sitting all the challenges. That students and Educators and families have faced over the last A couple of years. I really think all the edtech companies out there will succeed by catering to all the different learning styles. Like I mentioned before delightfully disrupting, the average lecturer allowing more collaboration between everyone. So I think there is actually more of an opportunity here especially given the last couple of years to cater and use the technology that's available for everyone's different learning style. I'm a product person at heart and the one thing you learn really quickly is that you can't force something. Other people all the best products out there are really pulled out of you by the people using them. That's a great quote, I love that. Okay.

26:57 You can't force the product on people. Definitely, that never works. Yeah, and it really doesn't work. I've been in that situation before and nobody's picking up what you're putting down out there. But when you flip it and you basically see customers as allies in your kind of co-creating it together, that's where the magic happens. And we really do see that in edtech right now. There's this genuine desire to incorporate technology to better the learning outcomes of their students. So I think for all of us in the Ed Tech space, and we're not the type that says, we need to get ahead and everyone else can't. I think there's a huge opportunity for all of us to really work and kind of co-create with the Educators out there to make this a reality and bring at Tech forward but not selfishly. But for the betterment of everyone here that is, that is so inspiring and I love the way you approach that question. Ian and thank you so much for coming on the show. I had a great time talking about goose chase and I'm sure the audience loved the to everything about goose chase, where to find out where to sign up, where to connect with Andrew and his wonderful team is going to be in the show notes. So thank you Andrew so much for your time and coming on at up a deck.

28:10 Yeah, absolutely. Thank you so much for having me. I appreciate it. A lot of fun. Yeah. You've just experienced another fantastic episode of Ed up edtech. Thank you so much for listening. Be sure to check us out on our website at Ed up. Ed Tech.com. Keep yourself in the know about all the latest and greatest edtech happenings see you next time.